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Old 03-27-2012, 11:39   #176
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The Terrors had nothing to do with people turning from the Church. It had to do with a complete breakdown of the social order. The American Civil War was bloodier than the French Revolution and those were Christians killing Christians. So was the 30 Years War. You conveniently ignore atrocities committed by Christians. You conveniently ignore the atrocities committed against the Jews by Christians.
And you conveniently ignore the 100,000,000 killed by your fellow atheists.
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Old 03-27-2012, 11:40   #177
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So you believe the world is flat?
Why would we? The Bible says "The Lord sits upon the circle of the earth."
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Old 03-27-2012, 11:40   #178
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^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
What flavor is your Kool-Aid ?
So if I call atheists Kool-Aid drinkers, would it be really clever?
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Old 03-27-2012, 12:26   #179
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So if I call atheists Kool-Aid drinkers, would it be really clever?
No

Some atheist might drink kool-aid but being atheists does not mean you drink Kool-aid.
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Old 03-27-2012, 12:46   #180
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And you conveniently ignore the 100,000,000 killed by your fellow atheists.
Can you name one person killed in the name of atheism? Communism and Nazism, or any other fascist style of government is not synonymous with atheism.
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Old 03-27-2012, 13:02   #181
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The Terrors had nothing to do with people turning from the Church. It had to do with a complete breakdown of the social order. The American Civil War was bloodier than the French Revolution and those were Christians killing Christians. So was the 30 Years War. You conveniently ignore atrocities committed by Christians. You conveniently ignore the atrocities committed against the Jews by Christians.
The French Revolution was the common people against the aristocracy. Nothing to do with Christianity.

The American Civil War was Americans killing Americans. Nothing to do with Christianity.

The Christian atrocities such as persecution of the Jews, the Inquisition, Salem witch hunts, and religous based wars were not Christian doctrine. Not the teachings of Christ. They will be judged harshly.

I'm not aware of any major wars in the past few hundred years that were religous based. All of the major wars were based on greed, hate, and a myriad of political reasons... all secular.

Since your comments above seem to equate people born in Christian majority countries are automatically Christians. Then by that logic, YOU must be a practicing Christian.



Judging by some of the atheist posts in this thread, evidence of chronic frustration is apparent. Very amusing.
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Old 03-27-2012, 13:16   #182
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Can you name one person killed in the name of atheism? Communism and Nazism, or any other fascist style of government is not with atheism.
Communist countries have discouraged if not outlawed religion.
Nazis were secular, though Hitler, Himmler, Goering and many of the SS were into the occult.
Are Christian majority countries synonymous with Christianity?

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Old 03-27-2012, 14:53   #183
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And you conveniently ignore the 100,000,000 killed by your fellow atheists.
I'm not ignoring anything other than the hypocrisy of Christians killing in the name of the Prince of Peace and justifying it by saying they are no worse than the atheists.
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Old 03-27-2012, 14:57   #184
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Are Christian majority countries synonymous with Christianity?
According to Paul7 and snowbird, everyone living in a Muslim country is a Muslim and lives only to kill Christians. Why the double standard?
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Old 03-27-2012, 16:40   #185
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Don't forget the anti-semitic Martin Luther and his book, On the Jews and Their Lies and Of the Unknowable Name and the Generations of Christ.
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Old 03-27-2012, 17:13   #186
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Originally Posted by Woofie View Post
Can you name one person killed in the name of atheism? Communism and Nazism, or any other fascist style of government is not synonymous with atheism.
Quote:
The quotation, in context, reads as follows (emphasis added):
The foundation of irreligious criticism is: Man makes religion, religion does not make man. Religion is, indeed, the self-consciousness and self-esteem of man who has either not yet won through to himself, or has already lost himself again. But man is no abstract being squatting outside the world. Man is the world of man – state, society. This state and this society produce religion, which is an inverted consciousness of the world, because they are an inverted world. Religion is the general theory of this world, its encyclopaedic compendium, its logic in popular form, its spiritual point d’honneur, its enthusiasm, its moral sanction, its solemn complement, and its universal basis of consolation and justification. It is the fantastic realization of the human essence since the human essence has not acquired any true reality. The struggle against religion is, therefore, indirectly the struggle against that world whose spiritual aroma is religion.
Religious suffering is, at one and the same time, the expression of real suffering and a protest against real suffering. Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people.
The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is the demand for their real happiness. To call on them to give up their illusions about their condition is to call on them to give up a condition that requires illusions. The criticism of religion is, therefore, in embryo, the criticism of that vale of tears of which religion is the halo.

-Karl Marx

You know, the guy on which all Communist Revolutions was founded upon? Yes, he was an Atheist, and Communism was an Atheist invention.

So, yes, Atheist philosophy is responsible for millions of dead.


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Old 03-27-2012, 17:26   #187
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-Karl Marx

You know, the guy on which all Communist Revolutions was founded upon? Yes, he was an Atheist, and Communism was an Atheist invention.

So, yes, Atheist philosophy is responsible for millions of dead.


[/INDENT]
Do you deny that religion is the opiate of the people? Have you never seen people high on Jesus?
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Old 03-27-2012, 17:38   #188
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Originally Posted by Kingarthurhk View Post
-Karl Marx

You know, the guy on which all Communist Revolutions was founded upon? Yes, he was an Atheist, and Communism was an Atheist invention.

So, yes, Atheist philosophy is responsible for millions of dead.


[/INDENT]
You know that guy Hitler liked to paint so yes, artistic tendencies are responsible for millions dead.
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Old 03-27-2012, 17:39   #189
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According to Paul7 and snowbird, everyone living in a Muslim country is a Muslim and lives only to kill Christians. Why the double standard?
So you are are Christian. Okay.
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Old 03-27-2012, 17:46   #190
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You know that guy Hitler liked to paint so yes, artistic tendencies are responsible for millions dead.
He was a vegetarian too, so that must also mean vegetarianism leads to evil.
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Old 03-27-2012, 17:46   #191
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Why would we? The Bible says "The Lord sits upon the circle of the earth."
And a circle is a two dimensional geometric object. Which is to say, flat.
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Old 03-27-2012, 18:17   #192
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You know that guy Hitler liked to paint so yes, artistic tendencies are responsible for millions dead.
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He was a vegetarian too, so that must also mean vegetarianism leads to evil.
I thought that I already established that it was the mustache.

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Old 03-27-2012, 18:17   #193
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So you are are Christian. Okay.
According to some misguided souls. As I have written before, I'm a recovering Christian.
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Old 03-27-2012, 20:38   #194
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You know that guy Hitler liked to paint so yes, artistic tendencies are responsible for millions dead.
Hitler was a Socialist movement, not a Communist movement. Also, Hitler's Germany was steeped in spritualism. The Communist movements were based on Karl Marx, and Atheist. The philsoophy behind Coummnism at its core is Atheism. So, we have seen modern Atheist governments in action and millions of dead as a result.
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Old 03-27-2012, 20:55   #195
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Hitler was a Socialist movement, not a Communist movement. Also, Hitler's Germany was steeped in spritualism. The Communist movements were based on Karl Marx, and Atheist. The philsoophy behind Coummnism at its core is Atheism. So, we have seen modern Atheist governments in action and millions of dead as a result.
Wrong. Dead wrong. The philosophy behind communism is the idea that everyone is provided for and everyone's talents are nurtured to the point where they are at maximum productivity.

The practice of communism is always that someone is in charge so they take advantage of their power by abusing the system for their own advantage to varying degrees until it eventually collapses.

If the philosophy behind communism were simply atheism then you would see communist governments wiping out religions and not really giving much concern to any other aspects of it's subjects lives since atheism is about non-belief in deity and nothing else.

And Hitler was a mass murdering bastard just like the others. That's the commonality I was using for that particular analogy. Did you really not catch that?

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Old 03-27-2012, 21:04   #196
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Wrong. Dead wrong. The philosophy behind communism is the idea that everyone is provided for and everyone's talents are nurtured to the point where they are at maximum productivity.

The practice of communism is always that someone is in charge so they take advantage of their power by abusing the system for their own advantage to varying degrees until it eventually collapses.

If the philosophy behind communism were simply atheism then you would see communist governments wiping out religions and not really giving much concern to any other aspects of it's subjects lives since atheism is about non-belief in deity and nothing else.

And Hitler was a mass murdering bastard just like the others. That's the commonality I was using for that particular analogy. Did you really not catch that?
Karl Marx founded the Communist Manifisto the philosophy behind the Communist movment. Karl Marx was an Atheist. One of the first acts of Communist Reovlutions is ban religion.

Ergo, Communism is an Atheist movement. I can't change the evidence because you find it inconvenient.
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Old 03-27-2012, 21:18   #197
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In reference to the OP: Why can't Christians, Jews, Muslims, et al. just do their own thing, be happy with that and leave everyone else alone?

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Karl Marx founded the Communist Manifisto the philosophy behind the Communist movment. Karl Marx was an Atheist. One of the first acts of Communist Reovlutions is ban religion.

Ergo, Communism is an Atheist movement. I can't change the evidence because you find it inconvenient.
Correlation does not equal causation. The Communist movements you're referencing combated organized religion because the movement wanted an oligarchic state where the state itself was the utmost authority in all things. The supreme deity, if you will. There is a long history of organized religion undermining the political actions of a secular elite (see the history of the Catholic Church and England). Communist actions against religious institutions had nothing to do with atheistic beliefs. Only the consolidation of power.
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Old 03-27-2012, 21:24   #198
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Correlation does not equal causation. The Communist movements you're referencing combated organized religion because the movement wanted an oligarchic state where the state itself was the utmost authority in all things. The supreme deity, if you will. There is a long history of organized religion undermining the political actions of a secular elite (see the history of the Catholic Church and England). Communist actions against religious institutions had nothing to do with atheistic beliefs. Only the consolidation of power.
It's founding Philsopher on which the whole Communist movement was about was an Atheist. Religion was outlawed under Communism. People keep trying to tell me Atheism is a good thing. I fail to see how. Millions of dead people are a decent testimony that it is not.

As I pointed out earlier, I won't defend the indefensible. You won't see me praising the Catholic Church, it has a long bloody history as well.
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Old 03-27-2012, 21:48   #199
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Karl Marx founded the Communist Manifisto the philosophy behind the Communist movment. Karl Marx was an Atheist. One of the first acts of Communist Reovlutions is ban religion.

Ergo, Communism is an Atheist movement. I can't change the evidence because you find it inconvenient.
Communist governments want religion out of the picture because they seek to be the ultimate authority in their subjects lives. Forcing atheism on communist people is convenient for the communist leaders because religion comes with loyalties so strong that they can't be broken even by logic and reason, much less an authoritarian government led by self serving power mongers. It's easier to wipe out the most devout as an example to the not so devout. Communism finds atheism convenient to serve it's purpose. It is not the driving force.

I can't change the evidence because you find it incomprehensible.
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Old 03-27-2012, 21:53   #200
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It's founding Philsopher on which the whole Communist movement was about was an Atheist. Religion was outlawed under Communism. People keep trying to tell me Atheism is a good thing. I fail to see how. Millions of dead people are a decent testimony that it is not.

As I pointed out earlier, I won't defend the indefensible. You won't see me praising the Catholic Church, it has a long bloody history as well.
I appreciate your intellectual honesty. We can agree to disagree and both point to instances of violence that are tied to people with and without religious beliefs. However, I think that we can both agree that the violence is not necessarily representative of those beliefs in the majority of cases. I would argue that 99 times out of 100, the arguments for the use of/against religion to justify violence are really just using the argument as a vehicle to advance other motives.

Regardlesss, I don't think that one set of beliefs is inherently more valid or morally correct than others so long as the actions and consequences corresponding with those beliefs are limited to the believer. The vast majoriy of atheists aren't "out to get" Christians, or visa versa. I do think that a very vocal minority of both groups go out of their way to create tension where none would exist if everyone just staid out of other peoples business and did their own thing.
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