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Old 12-21-2013, 10:35   #1
TGT
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Longer replacement barrel for G30S ??

I'd like to swap out the 3.77" factory barrel for a 4.25" to 4.5" or longer barrel so I can get increased velocity. The usual suspects, KKM, Lone Wolf, Barsto, etc. don't list the 30S as a candidate, (They only list the Glock 30) I presume that the barrel thickness is different between the model 30 and the 30S. (and I'm also guessing that the GL30S and 36 are the same barrels)

Anybody know where I can find a longer barrel for the 30S? I'll take it with or without muzzle threads, blue or stainless, or any way I can get it.
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Old 12-21-2013, 11:01   #2
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Look for glock 36 bbls
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Old 12-21-2013, 11:55   #3
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Some how I overlooked the Lone Wolf 4.33" barrel for the model 36. If that's all that's available which is about a 1/2" longer then the stock barrel, then I guess I'll have to settle for that.
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Old 12-21-2013, 12:26   #4
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Lone Wolf will be the lowest cost alternative I believe. They offer this 4.65 inch ported barrel too >>> LWD Barrel M/36/30S 45 ACP Extended 2 Port.

Some other manufacturers I've found that make extended length G36 barrels are EFK Fire Dragon and IGB Austria but they cost more. If one can believe the IGB Austria production catalog, they offer G36 barrels ranging up to 6 inches in length, but I have no idea where one can purchase them in the USA.

Be mindful of the subtle differences in feed geometry between the G30S and G36 pistols. The G36 barrel will fit, but there is a possibility of failure-to-feed malfunctions using an aftermarket barrel. I don't know this for a fact, so don't let that discourage you.
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Old 12-21-2013, 12:30   #5
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How much velocity are you looking for? The compact platform is not the best starting point for maximizing ballistics.
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Old 12-21-2013, 13:04   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TGT View Post
I'd like to swap out the 3.77" factory barrel for a 4.25" to 4.5" or longer barrel so I can get increased velocity. The usual suspects, KKM, Lone Wolf, Barsto, etc. don't list the 30S as a candidate, (They only list the Glock 30) I presume that the barrel thickness is different between the model 30 and the 30S. (and I'm also guessing that the GL30S and 36 are the same barrels)

Anybody know where I can find a longer barrel for the 30S? I'll take it with or without muzzle threads, blue or stainless, or any way I can get it.
Unless you plan to use very lightweight bullets with a +P rating, don't expect too much velocity gain. My chrono tests over the years (plus published data I have studied) indicate that longer barrels in Glocks gives the most advantage with high velocity 9mm ammo. Even .40 does not gain tremendously with an extra inch of barrel.

I chronoed some Cor-Bon 115gr +P ammo in a G19 & a G34 on the same day (2/6/08). I got an average of 1338 fps for the G19, but 1449 fps for the G34... a 111 fps gain for the extra 0.81" barrel length. That's 457 ft. lbs. of energy vs. 536. Not bad.

Later that same year (11/10/08), I shot some 230gr +P Buffalo Bore FMJ flat point through a G30 & a G21; the results were not as signficant: 924 fps vs. 957 fps, or 436 ft.lbs vs 468 ft. lbs. using a the 3.78" barrel vs. the 4.6" barrel (about the same length difference as that between the G19 & the G34). That's only 33 fps gain... using +P ammo. I only have those +P flat point rounds for mountain trails in case I meet a bear (had one close call with no gun). I usually keep standard pressure rounds in my .45's, so a longer barrel (for velocity) is not important to me for my .45's.
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Old 12-22-2013, 03:54   #7
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I am curious, as well, but more because the 30S would make a Fun suppressor host. It is definitely a poor host to suppress, but perhaps a longer barrel could help.
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Old 12-22-2013, 04:12   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GRT45 View Post
Lone Wolf will be the lowest cost alternative I believe. They offer this 4.65 inch ported barrel too >>> LWD Barrel M/36/30S 45 ACP Extended 2 Port.

Some other manufacturers I've found that make extended length G36 barrels are EFK Fire Dragon and IGB Austria but they cost more. If one can believe the IGB Austria production catalog, they offer Gg36 barrels ranging up to 6 inches in length, but I have no idea where one can purchase them in the USA.

Be mindful of the subtle differences in feed geometry between the G30S and G36 pistols. The G36 barrel will fit, but there is a possibility of failure-to-feed malfunctions using an aftermarket barrel. I don't know this for a fact, so don't let that discourage you.
Per glock absolutly no difference between 36 and 30S slides

None
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Old 12-22-2013, 07:05   #9
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I would also agree that while you will get higher velocity, it won't be by much. Of course it does depend on the load, but with standard 230gr ammo you probably won't see 30-40 fps gain, if that.
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Old 12-22-2013, 09:18   #10
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Per glock absolutly no difference between 36 and 30S slides

None
hunter111, What does Glock say about the barrel?

I thought the feed ramp was slightly different... that would be the point where a feed problem might occur & I assume that's what GRT45 is talking about. Before the G30S came along, some shooters have had good luck with a G36 upper on a G30 frame - & some shooters have reported problems. I thought Glock tweaked the G30s barrel slightly.
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Old 12-22-2013, 09:29   #11
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I would also agree that while you will get higher velocity, it won't be by much. Of course it does depend on the load, but with standard 230gr ammo you probably won't see 30-40 fps gain, if that.
SD,
You will remember in another thread I wanted to build a GL30 into a 45 Super. I bought 45Super brass and was all ready to do it. But after researching some police shootings with 45cal, I've concluded that even a 200gr or 230gr 45 Super round at 1,050 to 1,100 FPS out of a model 30 with an extended 4.5" barrel, and enough muzzle flash to take pictures in the dark, may still not stop an attacker in his tracks. (unless you make a central nerve hit.) So why carry the extra bulk, and fire an above SAAMI round? My strategy now is to carry the slimmer & more concealable Glock 30S in my wasteband (as I always carry my pistols) , and fire 185+P or 200+p handloads with heavier RSA need be.

But to me, a 45 should be at least 4.25" to 4.5" like the tradtional commander length barrel. The extra 1/2" or so of barrel sticking out of the end of that blocky Glock 30S slide is a none issue to me and will slip down the wasteband easy, like so many guys that carry a full 5" 1911 slide down their wasteband. My complaint has always been an overly long grip on the 1911. Glock's grip is very concealable with both the 10+1 or 9+1 mags.
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Old 12-22-2013, 10:05   #12
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Wonder if the longer ported barrel would decrease muzzle rise in the 36 or 30s?
I have both the 36 &30S and the Lonewolf barrel might be fun to shoot.
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Old 12-22-2013, 10:46   #13
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Originally Posted by TGT View Post
But to me, a 45 should be at least 4.25" to 4.5" like the tradtional commander length barrel.
I recall some interesting chrono data pertinent to your deliberations on velocity and barrel length.

Shown below is some chrono evidence comparing the performance of Glock .45ACP barrels (with octagonal rifling) against performance of longer barrels with conventional rifling firing a XTP 230gr 45ACP reload.

In the case of Zombie Steve's reload, the velocity loss was only 29 fps for the 3.78" G30 barrel versus a 5" barrel of a 1911. The G30 matched the velocity from a 4.4" barrel in a SIG P220.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zombie Steve View Post
Here are my results all using Win brass, 6.6 grains WSF, CCI 300, 230 grain XTP loaded to 1.210" - 10 shots each.

G30 (3.78" bbl): 827 fps, 15sd
Sig P220 (4.4" bbl): 824fps, 14sd
SA TRP (5" bbl): 856, 17sd
G21 (4.6" bbl): 876, 13sd

So in my case, the shorter barrel G30 basically did the same job as the longer barreled Sig, and the G21 outperformed the longer barreled 1911. Accuracy was a different issue... 1911 was tightest, Sig a close second and the Glocks performing close to the same.

Is the extreme spread from 827 to 876 feet per second really significant? Probably not, but I think there's something to the rifling...
Bear in mind that modern, high-tech 45ACP JHP standard pressure ammo is designed to expand fully at the typical muzzle velocity for the caliber (800-900 fps). Ammo I place in this category include Speer Gold Dot, Winchester Ranger-T and Federal HST since they are constantly tested and evaluated by LE.

You were wise to abandon .45 Super for personal defense against human attackers. Stout recoil and the longer time it takes to get back on target for follow-up shots are disadvantages when speed counts. While not as bad, greater recoil of +P ammo in the light G36/G30S works against you for the small increase in velocity gained.

Mas Ayoob is a good resource in the GATE Self-Defense Forum to advise you on the preferred 45ACP grain weight and load based on data from actual shootings.
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Old 12-22-2013, 11:27   #14
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I took possesion of a new 36/30s Extended 2 port LWD barrel a few weeks ago. So far it has been nothing but problems. Some loads are BTF, some loads are failure to feed, and some loads are failure to go that last 1/8" into battery.

All those loads were fine in the stock barrel.

I hope to get in touch with LWD next week or maybe the first week of January to see what they recommend. I know it will eventually run with some tweaking.
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Old 12-22-2013, 11:42   #15
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Why would you want to push a g30s or 36? Just go get a g21 or 30? Get a 30 and put a 6" barrel in it? If you need more than 900fps I would even suggest you go buy a 10mm or 44 magnum bear gun where you can push the load at 1500+ fps
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Old 12-22-2013, 14:12   #16
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I took possesion of a new 36/30s Extended 2 port LWD barrel a few weeks ago. So far it has been nothing but problems. Some loads are BTF, some loads are failure to feed, and some loads are failure to go that last 1/8" into battery.

All those loads were fine in the stock barrel.

I hope to get in touch with LWD next week or maybe the first week of January to see what they recommend. I know it will eventually run with some tweaking.
Yikes, hope you can work out the problems with that barrel.
Are you shooting it in a 30S or 36?
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Old 12-22-2013, 14:33   #17
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Yikes, hope you can work out the problems with that barrel.
Are you shooting it in a 30S or 36?
JR


Its being used in my 36.


It's my understanding that this is not uncommon at all with many of the aftermarket barrels. The LWD barrel is approximately 2 and a half thousandths tighter than the stock Glock chamber. I think if I have them open it up half that it will probably start running just fine.


I am not too worried about it. I have another thread in here on the subject, and will do my best to keep it updated as progress is made on this barrel.
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Old 12-22-2013, 15:38   #18
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I would be at least vaguely concerned about the reliability of an after market barrel and the same forum mentioned above Mr. Ayoob again recently explained an excellent reason why handloads can be an issue in a shooting.
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Old 12-22-2013, 20:44   #19
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been looking for a 4.6 inch for my G36 for 3 years IGB has not got back to me in over a year for a custom
no other main line will go ove the 4.33 (thats if you can get them to non port or thread a barrel )
for me it so i can build a long slide for mu G36 and have a G21 length barrel and slim slide
i have he SS slide ruffed out but stopped when i could not source a slide
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Old 12-22-2013, 20:52   #20
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double tap

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Old 12-22-2013, 22:51   #21
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GRT,

Thanks for the input as well as the links to the suppliers.
I intend to obtain a 30S and try it out as is with the factory barrel and see if I think it will suffice before I go changing out the barrel. But I wanted to see if at least a longer barrel was available should I decide to go that route. I've never much cared for the "slow moving freight train analogy" which folks will often use to describe that large and massive slow moving 45 cal bullet. As for me, I prefer a fast moving train myself!! I've seen too many old classic movies that depict hobos catching a ride on those slow moving trains. LOL I'm also not fully impressed by the modern bullet technology that has these 45 cal HP bullets flowering open at 900 FPS. Sure it will kill, but I just feel like the bullet is lacking the hydraulic impact and shock value. I'm looking for a mushrooming HP to start at at least1,050FPS. I currently shoot a Golden Saber 185+P out of a 5" Para Ord P14 doing 1,100 FPS. -Now we're talking! But, a P14 is a big pistol and not for CHL carry. I'd like to handload and see if I get near those kind of velocities out of the Glock. Yes, a 10MM does those velocities, but it's not a big wide 45 bullet, nor has it got that slim Glock 30S slide.

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Old 12-23-2013, 07:10   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noponer View Post
...
I chronoed some Cor-Bon 115gr +P ammo in a G19 & a G34 on the same day (2/6/08). I got an average of 1338 fps for the G19, but 1449 fps for the G34... a 111 fps gain for the extra 0.81" barrel length. That's 457 ft. lbs. of energy vs. 536. Not bad.

....

I thought there was more than an inch difference in barrel lengths between the G19 and G34.
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Old 12-23-2013, 08:09   #23
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I thought there was more than an inch difference in barrel lengths between the G19 and G34.
According to the Glock Websight, 4.01" VS 5.31" Yes, a 1.3" longer barrel would make the kind of velocity gain in a 9mm cartridge that he's indicating.
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Old 12-23-2013, 08:41   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noponer View Post
...
I chronoed some Cor-Bon 115gr +P ammo in a G19 & a G34 on the same day (2/6/08). I got an average of 1338 fps for the G19, but 1449 fps for the G34... a 111 fps gain for the extra 0.81" barrel length. That's 457 ft. lbs. of energy vs. 536. Not bad.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce M View Post
I thought there was more than an inch difference in barrel lengths between the G19 and G34.
You are correct. I pulled the 4.49" barrel length for a G19 from my head :, but that's a G17 barrel length. Sorry. As TGT says, a G34 barrel is well over 1" longer than a G19.

I could not find any chrono results in my files for a G17 with the Cor-Bon 115+P ammo, but expect the velocity is closer to a G19 than a G34... still significantly more velocity & energy gain than in .45's, per inch of barrel increase.
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Old 12-23-2013, 10:56   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TGT View Post
I've never much cared for the "slow moving freight train analogy" which folks will often use to describe that large and massive slow moving 45 cal bullet. As for me, I prefer a fast moving train myself!! I've seen too many old classic movies that depict hobos catching a ride on those slow moving trains. LOL I'm also not fully impressed by the modern bullet technology that has these 45 cal HP bullets flowering open at 900 FPS. Sure it will kill, but I just feel like the bullet is lacking the hydraulic impact and shock value.
TGT, heaven knows, I can relate to the feeling of a "need for speed" and bigger bullets, as my sig line below indicates in the Glock sidearm caliber conversions I've chosen for woods protection. However, reality and manly preferences often differ (both with firearms and women).

The Steve Lang shooting incident that Mas Ayoob has written about gave me much to think about regarding training, ammo, pistol capacity and spare mags. You might be interested too. In an earlier post, I briefly summarized the article with emphasis on the action taken by the LEO immediately after the shooting pertaining to his ammo choice (see below).

Quote:
Originally Posted by GRT45 View Post
Mas Ayoob's column in the May/June 2011 issue of American Handgunner magazine (available online) is a remarkable story of a shootout between a 20-yr veteran LEO and a BG where both had .45ACP pistols. The gunfight occurred at extreme close range (6 feet) and neither man had benefit of cover. The LEO had a G21 with 14 rnds and the BG had a Sig P220 with 9 rnds. Both guns were empty at the end of the fight and the BG ran out of bullets first. The LEO was hit once in the leg and the BG was hit seven times (he survived). It's an important lesson about having the right ammo and adequate round capacity.

See The Ayoob Files - Dueling .45s: The Steve Lang Incident (Page 32)

The LEO switched from 185gr CorBon +P JHP to 230gr Speer Gold Dot JHP immediately after the gunfight.

Below is an excerpt from the article where the LEO explains his reason for switching to 230gr ammo:
" He was not pleased with his bullets’ performances. He feels his 185-grain bullets, at approximately 1,150 foot-seconds, opened too soon and did not penetrate as much as might have been optimal. One shot did massive damage tracking up the suspect’s arm, but did not exit the arm to reenter the chest, which Lang feels might have stopped the action sooner. Immediately after the gunfight, he switched to Gold Dot 230-grain .45 ACP for the Glock 21 he continued to carry in uniform. "
For reference, Mas Ayoob loads 230gr Winchester Ranger-T JHP in his CCW Glock 30 45ACP pistol. He will be glad to tell you his reasons if you pose the question to him in the GATE Self-Defense Forum at Glock Talk.

Another good choice is 230gr Speer Gold Dot JHP because of its reputation in LE and documented performance. The companion practice ammo (Speer Lawman TMJ 230gr) with equivalent accuracy, recoil, and muzzle flash is an added bonus for realistic training.

Federal HST 230gr +P JHP is the third excellent choice for a 45ACP CCW round that Ayoob always mentions.
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