GlockTalk.com
Home Forums Classifieds Blogs Today's Posts Search Social Groups



  
SIGN-UP
Notices

Glock Talk
Welcome To The Glock Talk Forums.

 
  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-01-2011, 16:17   #1
walrus108
Senior Member
 
walrus108's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Georgetown, TX
Posts: 957
Send a message via AIM to walrus108
Cost per round?

***I have recently purchased a 10mm EAA Witness Match. Awesome gun that has been totally reliable and extremely accurate with CCI Blazer 200gr with a claimed velocity of 1050. I have searched for hours for the past few days looking for specific answers. Can't find them so I'm starting a few threads, each with a different question. Please see my other post if you think you can help. Thanks***

I want to start reloading so I can shoot this gun more. I can get that blazer ammo for $0.50 per/rnd. What are you frugal ones with experience paying per round to load good, accurate full power (but not extreme) 10mm? A related question, would i be better off buying loaded rounds bulk, shooting them, and saving the brass? Or buy once fired brass and load it myself?
__________________
There are two ways to slide easily through life; to believe everything or to doubt everything. Both ways save us from thinking. -Alfred Korzybski
walrus108 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2011, 18:23   #2
_The_Shadow
Ret. Fireman
 
_The_Shadow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Southeast, LoUiSiAna
Posts: 4,373
If you are just starting from scratch the start up cost can be more than bulk bullet purchases when you figure in the time and effort. But when you consider you can produce match quality custom handloads for tthe 10mm the savings add up to about 1/2 to 3/4 of what the commercial stuff cost. The more you load over time the more return on the investment.

The cost is all based on which componnets you choose especially bullets...Real copper jacketed bullet are costly but great performers.

That being said I cast my own bullets from wheel weight materials that I essencially got for near nothing so only my time, electricty an mould cost figure into the actual bullet cost. Therefore cost are minimal and they shoot very well with proper loading.

Plated bullets are cheaper alternative to jacketed bullets but care needs to be taken not to over drive them or over crimp them. The plating can be damaged and their performance will suffer.

The thing about handloading is a labor of love in that you control every aspect of the processes producing quality ammo to your specifications.

Enjoy and be safe!
__________________
Southeast, LoUiSiAna
NRA Life Member
BASS Life Member
_The_Shadow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2011, 20:06   #3
BenKeith
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 125
Bullets $100 - $135 per 1000 much more for high quality bullets
CCI 300 Primers $35 per 1000
Powder $20 - $30 per 1000
StarLine Brass $150 per 1000

Time spent loading 1000 with limited, single stage equipment = hours

I only buy new, StarLine brass, that way I know what quality brass I have and I only load extreme loads in new brass, then only use it for lighter loaded, practice ammo after shooting one hot load out of it.

I figure that little extra security with quality brass is worth a lot more than having a gun turn loose in your hand when cheap brass fails.

Last edited by BenKeith; 07-01-2011 at 20:16..
BenKeith is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2011, 20:08   #4
ModGlock17
Senior Member
 
ModGlock17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lalaland USA
Posts: 2,641
I've thinking about reloading as well, from the economic aspect. Brass ~19cents, Bullet ~12cents, etc. The best number I can come up with for reloading is somewhere sub-$.40 per round. Is this correct?

I can buy fairly OK 10mm ammo for $.44 per round shipped. Not too much savings.

So the real driver has to be "having control" on power levels and the operational engineering aspect of it.

Now if I look at hi-power rounds, they can be easily $1-$2 each. Even at $.50 per round reloading, it is worth it.

What's holding me back is that I have no access to places where I can fire the reloads. Wish I have 10 acres in the woods. Indoor ranges around my place prohibit reloaded ammo, for good reason. I would stay away from newbie reloaders if they show up at the range.

Last edited by ModGlock17; 07-01-2011 at 20:13..
ModGlock17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2011, 20:39   #5
hubcap500
Senior Member
 
hubcap500's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Iowa
Posts: 245
Many years ago I figured that I could load a factory equivalent bullet at about three or four to one ratio. If I cast my own bullet, it was about 10 to 1. I'd imagine the ratios are still about the same. That of course depends too on how much reloading equipment you decide to buy.
hubcap500 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2011, 21:44   #6
texas 48
Gold Membership
Citizen
 
texas 48's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: San Antonio, TEXAS
Posts: 1,685
The ammo u are buying for .44 per round are bunny fart loads equivalent to middle velocity
40 S&W. You can make full power high quality round with new components cost is about .42 per round. Double tap medium velocity but good round is about .90 per unit. Cost drops to .23 per round using fired brass with the same velocity and better quality than Double Tap. savings 1/2 to 3/4 of commercial ammo
__________________
THE HYPNOTIZED NEVER LIE
NRA Member
TSRA Member.
texas 48 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2011, 22:01   #7
walrus108
Senior Member
 
walrus108's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Georgetown, TX
Posts: 957
Send a message via AIM to walrus108
The major cost seem to be brass and bullets.

Just how many times can I reload the brass if I keep pressures low? I've noticed in the reloading manuals that some very fast loads aren't at all high pressure, so pressure doesn't seem to equate to what most would call 'hot' loads.

So maybe the first 500 would be relatively costly, but if I reuse all my brass, the second and beyond would be fairly inexpensive. Does that sound about right?
__________________
There are two ways to slide easily through life; to believe everything or to doubt everything. Both ways save us from thinking. -Alfred Korzybski
walrus108 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2011, 22:24   #8
MinervaDoe
Senior Member
 
MinervaDoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Way out in left field
Posts: 7,200
Blog Entries: 5
My guestimate for reloading my used brass with plated bullets is 16 cents a round. If I include the cost of brass, it is 33 cents per round.

Quote:
Just how many times can I reload the brass if I keep pressures low?
I've seen someone on this forum mention that they have reloaded their 10mm brass eleven times.

When you are trying to calculate the cost of powder, keep in mind that there are 7,000 grains in a pound of powder.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
MinervaDoe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2011, 22:29   #9
Electrikkoolaid
Grape flavored!
 
Electrikkoolaid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 810
The first bullet you reload is the most expensive.
__________________
We need to stop asking "who will pay for healthcare" and start asking "why does it cost so much?"
Electrikkoolaid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2011, 00:14   #10
21Carrier
Until I Gota 29
 
21Carrier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Hoover, AL
Posts: 3,037
GET INTO RELOADING!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ESPECIALLY if you are shooting 10mm. The CRAP you get in bulk will be worthless compared to what you can make. It is anemic, barely hotter than .40S&W AT BEST. If you like the idea of shooting .40S&W out of 10mm cases in your 10mm gun, then by all means, keep buying the cheap bulk stuff.

On the other hand, you can front the money for a loading setup, save SOME money (in the long-run), though likely not THAT much. You will, however, shoot a good bit more, and more importantly, you will be shooting REAL 10mm stuff. Even warm reloads will absolutely blow that bulk ammo out of the water. My warm 180gr reloads are doing about 1225fps. Now THAT is 10mm target ammo!!! My 200gr loads would be doing about 1100fps (but REALLY doing 1100fps).

Just do it, and never look back. It is obsessively fun, and being able to make fifty each of 5-10 different loadings (different weight bullets/different power levels) to take to the range is absolutely PRICELESS. No longer will you be shooting the same boring, weak load over and over. Want some nuclear stuff, load it up. Want some bunny-fart stuff, load it up. Want to go hunting, load it up. The diversity and range of 10mm should not be imprisoned by factory ammo.

About buying bulk and saving brass, DO IT!!! While you're shooting all this junk ammo, and getting ready for reloading, you're just racking up brass. And it will likely be GOOD brass, that you KNOW is only once-fired. The "once-fired" bulk brass you buy is just range pick-up, so who knows if some have been fired twenty times. I know some use it, but the only brass I use is once-fired Remington UMC (fired by ME, awesome nickel brass) and new Starline (or any new brass).

GET INTO RELOADING!!! You will NEVER regret it, I swear. BTW, did I capitalize enough words in this post for y'all?! Can you tell I'm REALLY enthusiastic about reloading 10mm? Seriously, though, it is the most fun you will have with a pistol. Amazing caliber, but to get all you can from it, reloading is a MUST.

Last edited by 21Carrier; 07-02-2011 at 00:17..
21Carrier is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2011, 04:34   #11
BenKeith
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 125
If you shoot or want to shoot a 10mm very much, and live on a budget like most of us, you can't afford not to reload them.

I bought my Glock 20 about four months ago. This is the first handgun I've actually put any effort into learning how to shoot and carry. Being somewhat of a newbee to handgruns, I'm up to approx 2,600 rounds through it in those four months, getting where I'm good enough to feel comfortable I can actually get off some quick shots and hit something if I needed to. If I was having to buy even cheap, loaded ammo, it would have been tough on my bank account.

If you shoot much, it won't take long to recoupe the cost of a cheap, Lee Press and four die set. Plus the fact, you can load REAL 10mm loads.

I've been reloading 44 years so all I had to buy was a set of dies, but just the 10mm alone would have been enough to make me start loading if I wasn't already, because of the cost and quality of available ammo.
BenKeith is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2011, 07:10   #12
GTRhino24
Blazin' 10mm x2
 
GTRhino24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Hoover, AL
Posts: 193
Cheaper than dirt....

I'm a spreadsheet guy by profession so the first logical thing for me to do was calculate cost per round based on raw materials. Since I planned on loading mostly target rounds, I used good brass/powder/primers but decided that the bullets would be the only variable really. Here are the costs associated with the first and second loads. I plan on getting at least 10 loads with Starline and an aftermarket barrel since I don't run em too far past posted maxes.

1st load (1000 rds):
Starline Brass - $.15/rd
CCI 300 Primers - $.03/rd
Power Pistol - $.02/rd
180 JHP Magnus - $.18/rd
Total - $.38/rd or $19/box

2nd load (1000 rds):
Starline Brass - $.00 <-- That feels good.
Everything else is the same.
Total - $.21/rd or $10.50/box

I have a blast reloading so the labor part doesn't bother me in the least. Do I save money? Probably not because now I shoot 2-300rds per trip to the range.
__________________
G26, G29SF, G20SF
GTRhino24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2011, 08:33   #13
nickE10mm
F.S.F.O.S.
 
nickE10mm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Wichita, KS
Posts: 4,357
Send a message via AIM to nickE10mm Send a message via MSN to nickE10mm Send a message via Yahoo to nickE10mm
After all said and done, I think I pay around 12 15 cents per round using reloaded cases and cheap (lead or plated) bullets. If I step up to new brass and nicer, more expensive or specialty bullets, my price is closer to 22-25 cents a round.

Still, $6-$12/box of 50 is DANG GOOD!!!

Do yourself a favor and start reloading...



ps... the reason I don't count my brass cost is that I haven't bought any yet! I saved my factory brass for a year or more before getting starting reloading so I consider it free, water under the bridge.
__________________
10 Ring #1033 - Longslide #1045 - 10mm Loader #1066

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.

Why do I carry a 10mm?
“Because a 9mm only kills your body… the 10mm kills your soul.”

Last edited by nickE10mm; 07-02-2011 at 12:20..
nickE10mm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2011, 09:47   #14
GTRhino24
Blazin' 10mm x2
 
GTRhino24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Hoover, AL
Posts: 193
Quote:
Originally Posted by nickE10mm View Post
After all said and done, I think I pay around 12 15 cents per round using reloaded cases and cheap (lead or plated) bullets. If I step up to new brass and nicer, more expensive or specialty bullets, my price is closer to 22-25 cents a round.

Still, $6-$12/box of 50 is DANG GOOD!!!

Do yourself a favor and start reloading...
Yeah, I forgot to mention that I paid a little more for the jacketed bullets because I didn't yet have an aftermarket barrel. Now that I have that (LW 5.5"), I can get some plated or lead Rainier and get it down to $.16-.17 per rd. I don't think I'll ever start molding my own so that's about as cheap as I'm going to see it.

As far as "designer" bullets, those are little treats you can pick up here and there. Since you already have the other components, it doesn't sting so bad if you want to whip up some hot loads every now and then. Shooting hot 10mm hand loads for the cost of "bunny fart" 9mm is awesome in itself.
__________________
G26, G29SF, G20SF
GTRhino24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2011, 11:41   #15
MinervaDoe
Senior Member
 
MinervaDoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Way out in left field
Posts: 7,200
Blog Entries: 5
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTRhino24 View Post
Yeah, I forgot to mention that I paid a little more for the jacketed bullets because I didn't yet have an aftermarket barrel. Now that I have that (LW 5.5"), I can get some plated or lead Rainier and get it down to $.16-.17 per rd. I don't think I'll ever start molding my own so that's about as cheap as I'm going to see it.
You can shoot plated bullets through a stock Glock barrel. All the competition shooters do.
You just need to keep the speed below 1,200 fps though.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
MinervaDoe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2011, 11:56   #16
Taterhead
Counting Beans
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Boise, Idaho
Posts: 3,086
Buy Starline brass direct. No shipping charged. It will be less than $150 for a thousand. I get an average of 9 loads from my 10mm brass. So 9000 loads for $150 really contributes to savings. For bullets, guys mentioned plated, and I shoot a lot of them. A lot of clubs will organize a group buy so the savings can be pretty good. I have purchased Berry's 180 gr plated through my club's group order and paid less than $90 per tbousand. So the average cost of range ammo for me has been as low as:

Brass: $0.02
bullet: $0.09
Powder: $0.04
Primer: $0.03
Total: $18/100

That is rounding up.

Full power defense loads using new brass:

Brass: $0.14
Bullet: $0.19
Powder: $0.04
Primer: $0.03
Total: $40/100
Compare that to the cost of premium SD ammo and you see pretty good savings.

Last edited by Taterhead; 07-02-2011 at 11:57..
Taterhead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2011, 12:34   #17
TDC20
Senior Member
 
TDC20's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 642
If you want to become a good/great/exceptional shooter, you have to send a lot of lead downrange (practice). If you're going to be shooting a lot, you will need a lot of money or you will become a hand loader.

One thing to consider is if you have a shop nearby where you can purchase powders and primers. If not, you will have to mail order those and they hit you with an extra fee for hazardous shipping (I think it's somewhere around $25, but I have never paid it because I live in reloader's paradise ). You can't ship both powder and primers on the same hazardous shipment fee, either, so that's $25 each. That hurts, so keep that in mind, too.
TDC20 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2011, 12:43   #18
nickE10mm
F.S.F.O.S.
 
nickE10mm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Wichita, KS
Posts: 4,357
Send a message via AIM to nickE10mm Send a message via MSN to nickE10mm Send a message via Yahoo to nickE10mm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TDC20 View Post
If you want to become a good/great/exceptional shooter, you have to send a lot of lead downrange (practice). If you're going to be shooting a lot, you will need a lot of money or you will become a hand loader.

One thing to consider is if you have a shop nearby where you can purchase powders and primers. If not, you will have to mail order those and they hit you with an extra fee for hazardous shipping (I think it's somewhere around $25, but I have never paid it because I live in reloader's paradise ). You can't ship both powder and primers on the same hazardous shipment fee, either, so that's $25 each. That hurts, so keep that in mind, too.
Yep, and for me... well, I work ten minutes away from Graf's Reloading. Lucky me!!
__________________
10 Ring #1033 - Longslide #1045 - 10mm Loader #1066

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.

Why do I carry a 10mm?
“Because a 9mm only kills your body… the 10mm kills your soul.”
nickE10mm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-03-2011, 16:28   #19
walrus108
Senior Member
 
walrus108's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Georgetown, TX
Posts: 957
Send a message via AIM to walrus108
Quote:
Originally Posted by 21Carrier View Post
GET INTO RELOADING!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ESPECIALLY if you are shooting 10mm. The CRAP you get in bulk will be worthless compared to what you can make. It is anemic, barely hotter than .40S&W AT BEST. If you like the idea of shooting .40S&W out of 10mm cases in your 10mm gun, then by all means, keep buying the cheap bulk stuff.

On the other hand, you can front the money for a loading setup, save SOME money (in the long-run), though likely not THAT much. You will, however, shoot a good bit more, and more importantly, you will be shooting REAL 10mm stuff. Even warm reloads will absolutely blow that bulk ammo out of the water. My warm 180gr reloads are doing about 1225fps. Now THAT is 10mm target ammo!!! My 200gr loads would be doing about 1100fps (but REALLY doing 1100fps).

Just do it, and never look back. It is obsessively fun, and being able to make fifty each of 5-10 different loadings (different weight bullets/different power levels) to take to the range is absolutely PRICELESS. No longer will you be shooting the same boring, weak load over and over. Want some nuclear stuff, load it up. Want some bunny-fart stuff, load it up. Want to go hunting, load it up. The diversity and range of 10mm should not be imprisoned by factory ammo.

About buying bulk and saving brass, DO IT!!! While you're shooting all this junk ammo, and getting ready for reloading, you're just racking up brass. And it will likely be GOOD brass, that you KNOW is only once-fired. The "once-fired" bulk brass you buy is just range pick-up, so who knows if some have been fired twenty times. I know some use it, but the only brass I use is once-fired Remington UMC (fired by ME, awesome nickel brass) and new Starline (or any new brass).

GET INTO RELOADING!!! You will NEVER regret it, I swear. BTW, did I capitalize enough words in this post for y'all?! Can you tell I'm REALLY enthusiastic about reloading 10mm? Seriously, though, it is the most fun you will have with a pistol. Amazing caliber, but to get all you can from it, reloading is a MUST.
I LOVE it man! LOL

Very informative post and couldn't be more enthusiastic. All of you guys told me just what I needed to hear. I'm taking your advice. I am ordering the kit.

Thank-you all for the info.
__________________
There are two ways to slide easily through life; to believe everything or to doubt everything. Both ways save us from thinking. -Alfred Korzybski
walrus108 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-03-2011, 18:45   #20
MinervaDoe
Senior Member
 
MinervaDoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Way out in left field
Posts: 7,200
Blog Entries: 5
Good choice. The initial outlay is a huge chunk, but then later, you'll be shooting when other people are home talking about how expensive ammunition is.

Welcome to the club. Get several reloading manuals and read up on how to set up your dies and powder measures and then get back to us with questions, questions, questions.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
MinervaDoe is offline   Reply With Quote

 
  
Reply


Tags
10mm, brass, cost, once fired
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 13:31.




Homepage
FAQ
Forums
Calendar
Advertise
Gallery
GT Wiki
GT Blogs
Social Groups
Classifieds


Users Currently Online: 924
258 Members
666 Guests

Most users ever online: 2,672
Aug 11, 2014 at 2:31