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Old 03-29-2011, 19:05   #1
Burien
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10mm High Pressure looks like this... Pic's attached...

Well this is what a KKM Smile looks like with WAY too much Tite-Group powder and a short COL of solid copper LONG bullet, 8.6 gr and 140 lead free long bullets sat at 1.250 COL=

The 10 Ring

The 10 Ring


The 10 Ring

I will stick with 800x and a longer COL 1.265" see what happens..

These primers were long lost, maybe the extreme cold helped this happen, but all pulled down now, the last one on the right is a new starline case

Last edited by Burien; 03-29-2011 at 19:07..
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Old 03-29-2011, 19:47   #2
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Yep - that is exactly like what I get - though I don't get the powder stains quite like that - nor the leaks on the primer seal like the one on the left - did any of the primers hit you in the head?

Note the smiley is just about right at the case web - same as my barrel exactly. Kevin's got it right on these.
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Old 03-29-2011, 19:55   #3
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YIKES! Thanks for the photos.
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Old 03-29-2011, 19:58   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burien View Post
Well this is what a KKM Smile looks like with WAY too much Tite-Group powder and a short COL of solid copper LONG bullet, 8.6 gr and 140 lead free long bullets sat at 1.250 COL=

I will stick with 800x and a longer COL 1.265" see what happens..

These primers were long lost, maybe the extreme cold helped this happen, but all pulled down now, the last one on the right is a new starline case
Thank you for posting the pics. They're worth 1000 words.
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Old 03-29-2011, 20:00   #5
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Forgot to ask: what primers are you using?
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Old 03-29-2011, 21:05   #6
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These were Wolf LP regular, not mag primers, I just re-loaded some with 9.3 gr of 800x at 1.260. These bullets have the same length as Hornady 200 gr XTP's so... I'll report when I can.

Glad I can share with all, no hurt gun or shooter, just a lot of RCBS kinetic bullet puller action.

- I did Test these out in the summer, BUT it was in a factory glock barrel, had some bulges and light leaking thru the primer pocket, maybe the larger chamber enabled the brass to swell up and relive some of the pressure that way?
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Old 03-29-2011, 21:12   #7
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That seems like a $H*T TON of TG. The 40s&w max for 180gr bullets (I'm guessing the 140gr copper is between normal 180/200gr length) is 4.7gr, and TG is borderline too fast for 40. What made you go with TG for that load?
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Old 03-29-2011, 21:38   #8
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All I had at the time, but hope I save the next guy some brass and time.
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Old 03-29-2011, 21:41   #9
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that's somethin'....
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Old 03-30-2011, 05:37   #10
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I only use Winchester brass for full power loads. Starline seems softer.
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Old 03-30-2011, 06:52   #11
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Thanks for the info.

Yes, signs of excess pressure...

I commonly fire several shots into the ground outside the house when working up a new load, powder, etc. I can do that here without any legal, etc issues.

Most problematic issue used to be finding brass in the winter, during bad weather, etc. When getting close to max I want to check every case and not lose one...or have to fire "just one more".

Now I just hold the gun in a large plastic trash bag and fire the shot. Empty case stays inside!
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Old 03-30-2011, 07:51   #12
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Oh yeah, forgot to ask - did you have to pry any of those out by hand or did they all get flung by the extractor - I noted the nice extractor bite on the brass. :-)
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Old 03-30-2011, 07:51   #13
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Another thing to remember when "walking the line" on high pressure loads. You may have seasonal pressure variations depending on powder used. I know for a fact that Winchester 231 is one; however, in cold, less velocity results.
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Old 03-30-2011, 08:09   #14
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"Captain, she can't take much more." Yep, smiles, primers flattened/lost and head stamp smearing = way too hot! I've loaded some 9x25 Dillon's too hot and had similar brass looks, minus the lost primers. Ended-up breaking a couple of chucks on my RCBS Kinetic Bullet Puller and finally just threw away about sixty to seventy rounds. Pictures are definitely worth a thousand words. Thanks for the info.
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Old 03-30-2011, 08:45   #15
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One empty had to be pushed out by hand, not too much force.

I'm done with tite-group in 10mm. I'm very happy with 800x.
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Old 03-30-2011, 09:11   #16
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Which is why some ammo co.'s #'s using Barnes bullets have alway been absolutely unbelievable to me. The bullets are lloonngg and the recoil is very, very light. I don't need a chrono to tell me that they're far off the BF #'s.

IMO, 10mm is the only auto cartridge those bullets are any good for and IMO only the 125 and 140 are they any good in 10mm. I've got good exspansion with 125's in 10mm and .40. The 140's in .40 barely expanded at all in bare water jugs from a Glock 22. The 155's in 10mm expanded some but not even close to the 140's or 125's. The 140 and 155 in 10mm Mag would be sick on hog.

No way in hell I'll touch an 80 gr. Barnes in .380! It's bad enough as is but to throw 115+ gr. length bullet in that case with a featherweight expanding bullet?
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Old 03-30-2011, 09:22   #17
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Quote:
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I only use Winchester brass for full power loads. Starline seems softer.
That's interesting. It's been said the opposite in the past. I wonder if things have changed, or, if the heresay I heard was never true to begin with.
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Old 03-30-2011, 11:19   #18
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Yep, Those are a bit too much, better to load for reliability not just velocity...Yes the copper solids are very long bullets, the Barnes 140's are as long as the Hornady 200XTP's. see my post http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1327396

I had to re-adjust the AA9 loading, I dropped down to 12.7 grains and bullet will only seat to 1.270", This may get adjusted again to seat to 1.255". I may also adjust the AA7 load upward some, as I continue to study everthing I can using these solid copper bullets.

Thanks for the pics they capture and show your experience well. The high impulse is pushing the slide back while pressure is still high, casing is swollen tight to chamber, hence the extractor over bite and the brass flow. Seeing the missing primers and leaks, also shows that the slide moved back away from the case head at some point before the bullet exited the barrel. A stronger recoil spring is not the answer for this either. You are wise to seek a different loading!
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Last edited by _The_Shadow; 03-30-2011 at 11:25.. Reason: added info
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Old 03-30-2011, 11:41   #19
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Another thing about TG is that it's REVERSE temperature sensitive. If those pressure symptoms occurred at summer temps, I'd hate to see what would happen at winter temps. Thanks for the report, hopefully it will save some guns/hands from damage in the future.
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Old 03-30-2011, 11:43   #20
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You are correct, I tested the load last summer about 80-85 temp worked fine, just some slight markings, this past weekend it was snow / cold day...

More pressure at lower temp... odd but true.
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