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Old 10-31-2010, 17:15   #1
m87
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9mm: Fiocchi 115 gr xtp vs Federal 115 gr hi-shock

I have a kel-tec PF9. Tried some of my gold dot 124+P and the recoil was a bit much; follow-up shots are slow and though this isn't a major concern for self-defense needs, it does hurt my hand after 7 quick shots.

Basically I'm looking for a 115 gr non+P load because this is such a light gun. I've narrowed it down to the Fiocchi($20/50) and Federal($16/50) b/c they fit this criteria and they are also a reasonable price for 50 rounds.

Other possible loads (looking at ATG's site) include the Black Hills 115 gr EXP ($30/50), some Cor-Bon loads, Rem UMC 115 gr (poor performer?) and Gold Dot 115 gr ($22/20).

Now I do realize that neither of my selected loads are the best available 9mm loads today and I myself prefer 124 gr loads anyway (I've never tried 147). However, I don't think heavier/faster loads are the best for my chosen kel-tec. I think the XTP(by Hornady) is probably a better bullet than the hi-shock, but I'm not sure if Fiocchi is as trustworthy as using a round made by Federal. As I understand it, the Hi-shock was a "proven, trusted" round years ago.

What do you think? Kel-tec, Kahr and other small 9mm owners are especially encouraged to reply...what do you use?
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Old 10-31-2010, 17:38   #2
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Fiocchi is good ammo & they use the Hornady XTP bullet in the 'Extrema' line.
115gr XTP http://www.ammunitiontogo.com/produc...low-point-ammo

124gr XTP http://www.ammunitiontogo.com/produc...low-point-ammo
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Old 10-31-2010, 17:52   #3
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Last time I checked Fiocchi's XTP loads are loaded to the same specs as Hornady's loads.

Personally I don't like the XTP style bullet and I would use Federal's 115JHP 9BP load. The 9BP has always been a very accurate load.

You may want to test a small amount of both loads in your pistol to check for function, accuracy and felt recoil before buying a large quantity of your choice.
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Old 10-31-2010, 18:20   #4
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Originally Posted by Merkavaboy View Post
...I would use Federal's 115JHP 9BP load. The 9BP has always been a very accurate load...
Ditto. The British anti-IRA units used the Fed. 9BP to great effect in their High Powers. IMO it is THE best 9mm non +p or non +p+ round that I know of.
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Old 11-04-2010, 17:01   #5
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I would also go with the Federal 9BP. I've used it off and on for 20 years and it has always been reliable, accurate ammo that feeds in just about anything and has a good reputation for stopping bad guys. It was used by some LE agencies back in the 1990s...maybe some still do.

I haven't shot any Fiocchi in 9mm but I have been disappointed in the .45 ACP Fiocchi Extrema ammo. Out of a case I bought, there always seems to be at least one dead primer per box of 50 as well as some occasional failures to fully feed in both a Glock 30 and a Colt Officer's ACP. This was surprising to me because I was impressed with the Fiocchi .38 Special ammo.
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Old 11-04-2010, 21:37   #6
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I carry the Fiocchi Extrema 115-grain XTP ammo in my PF-9 for two reasons:

1. It's the most accurate ammo I've shot to date in that pistol, and
2. It's my understanding that the XTP bullet's design favors penetration over expansion, which is not an inconsequential consideration in a short barrel pistol.
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Old 11-05-2010, 23:07   #7
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I also would go with the Federal 115 9BP.
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Old 11-06-2010, 07:38   #8
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Maybe try Hornaday "Critical Defense." I mention that because it's a non +P round and it's 115gr. Perhaps more than you're willing to pay but $19.00 a box of 25 at SGammo.com
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Old 11-06-2010, 08:36   #9
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The Keltec is not rated for +p ammo, so I would just run the standard pressure 124gr Gold Dots.

Here is 50 of them for $24.95.

http://www.ammunitiontogo.com/produc...oducts_id/1186

Or if you're set on 115gr, here is 50 Winchester Ranger Ts for $18.95.

http://www.ammunitiontogo.com/produc...oducts_id/2170

Last edited by FLglockdude; 11-06-2010 at 08:37..
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Old 11-06-2010, 14:23   #10
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Has anybody got any experience with standard pressure 115-grain Gold Dots?

As previously posted I like the Fiocchi 115-grain Extrema XTP but if the same weight Gold Dot round is as accurate I might give those a tryout.
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Old 11-06-2010, 14:25   #11
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Originally Posted by FLglockdude View Post
The Keltec is not rated for +p ammo...
It will take +p, however they don't recommend a steady diet of +p. I have shot one with Speer 124 gr. +p. Yes, it was "warm".
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Old 11-06-2010, 17:48   #12
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Thanks everyone.

I'm going to pick up a few boxes of the Federal 9BP.

With that said, does anybody know if the Fiocchi extrema is regular or more of a +p pressure?
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Old 11-07-2010, 07:10   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLglockdude View Post
The Keltec is not rated for +p ammo,
Mine is....

Either way, I'd go for the 9BP from your list.

I have run some of the 124+P GDs and they can be a bit snappy.
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Old 11-07-2010, 07:25   #14
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Thanks everyone.

I'm going to pick up a few boxes of the Federal 9BP.

With that said, does anybody know if the Fiocchi extrema is regular or more of a +p pressure?
From looking at the ballictics the Extrema looks like a standard pressure load but I have never tried it. Their 115 JHP load 9APHP is not marked as a +P but it shoots like a +P. It matches up with their 115 FMJ load 9AP. Both of these loads are hot.
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Old 11-07-2010, 08:44   #15
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Originally Posted by Ak.Hiker View Post
From looking at the ballictics the Extrema looks like a standard pressure load but I have never tried it. Their 115 JHP load 9APHP is not marked as a +P but it shoots like a +P. It matches up with their 115 FMJ load 9AP. Both of these loads are hot.
I used to shoot the Fiocchi 9APHP and I agree it's a hot round. Some people here on Glock Talk wrote that the hollow point bullet in that round is not a particularly good design so I quit carrying it. Does anybody know anything about the bullet in this round?

Also, although some Fiocchi rounds have the CIP stamp on the box it's my understanding that CIP is still standard pressure when considering using it in certain pistols. Is this correct?
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Old 11-07-2010, 11:16   #16
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I have a Kahr P9 and a PM9 and I use 147 grain Ranger T or 147 gr. HST in them.
The only 115 grain load I would use is the 115+p DPX from Corbon(or the Black Hills load that uses the same Barnes bullet).

115gr. loads generally don't penetrate well to begin with from service size guns so from a compact or subcompact I don't think they would be any better.

Last edited by Mr. S; 11-07-2010 at 11:18..
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Old 11-07-2010, 11:34   #17
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I think most people find Fiocchi 115g 9mm to be a bit hotter than average range ammo but I don't think it ranks with +P 9mm. Your average range ammo like American Eagle 9mm 115g has a velocity of 1180 fps and Fiocchi 9mm 115g is 1250. Fiocchi Extrema XTP 9mm 115g is 1245.

I think with enough range time you can get used to the difference and in my area, the 50 round boxes of Fiocchi Extrema XTP are the same price as the 25 round boxes of Gold Dot and Golden Saber.

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Old 11-07-2010, 11:42   #18
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...115gr. loads generally don't penetrate well to begin with from service size guns so from a compact or subcompact I don't think they would be any better.

Wrong. Penetration is WAY overrated anyway.
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Old 11-07-2010, 19:44   #19
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Wrong. Penetration is WAY overrated anyway.
What is wrong?
Care to elaborate?
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Old 11-07-2010, 22:08   #20
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The XTP bullet, as loaded in the Fiocchi Extrema ammo, was designed to meet the original FBI test results for penetration. While it does penetrate well (and the bullet is known to be highly accurate), it doesn't expand as well as many other bullets and, from what I've read, doesn't have a great track record for stopping bad guys.

As for why penetration is overrated, it's just kinda strange that some of the handgun rounds with the best history of in putting down bad guys failed to pass the FBI test for penetration yet seemed to work real good "where the rubber meets the road".

The more modern bullets used today, along with the newer powders, have resulted in better ammunition than was available in the past. In my not so humble opinion, all the arguments on websites over penetration vs expansion, what caliber is better and who makes the magic bullet are pretty much dead issues. Pick any of the modern handgun loads--Gold Dot, Ranger, Golden Saber, HST, whatever--and you're pretty much assured of having an effective self defense ammo. Of the older technology bullets, you have to be a little more picky but the best loads from the past can still do a good job today.

Just an opinion worth exactly what you're paying for it.
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