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Old 12-15-2012, 23:28   #1
LeipersForkFirearms
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Clackamas man, armed, confronted mall shooter

Here is a link to the full story and video, apparently during the mall shooting a few days ago a man confronted the gunman(with his glock) but did not engage as there were people moving behind the shooter. Shortly after the shooter saw the guy with the gun he moved to a stairwell and shot himself.....This is not being widely reported and needs to be!!!


[URL="http://www.kgw.com/news/Clackamas-man-armed-confronts-mall-shooter-183593571.html"]http://www.kgw.com/news/Clackamas-man-armed-confronts-mall-shooter-183593571.html[/URL]
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Old 12-16-2012, 07:49   #2
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Old 12-16-2012, 07:55   #3
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Originally Posted by LeipersForkFirearms View Post
Here is a link to the full story and video, apparently during the mall shooting a few days ago a man confronted the gunman(with his glock) but did not engage as there were people moving behind the shooter. Shortly after the shooter saw the guy with the gun he moved to a stairwell and shot himself.....This is not being widely reported and needs to be!!!


http://www.kgw.com/news/Clackamas-ma...183593571.html
It doesn't say the bad guy saw the good guy.
If the bad guy didn't see the good guy's gun it wasn't a confutation.
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Old 12-16-2012, 10:23   #4
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Here is another story on it.

http://www.easybakegunclub.com/news/1943/Clackamas-Mall-Shooter-Was-Confonted-By-Concealed-.html
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Old 12-16-2012, 11:17   #5
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Sometimes the Truth Hurts or should I say gets in the way. SJ 40
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Old 12-16-2012, 11:51   #6
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The guy didn't shoot for he feared hitting an innocent person behind the criminal. Well if he is such a poor pistol shot, he shouldn't be carrying. Ability to shoot well should be a requirement for getting a permit.
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Old 12-16-2012, 12:33   #7
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The guy didn't shoot for he feared hitting an innocent person behind the criminal. Well if he is such a poor pistol shot, he shouldn't be carrying. Ability to shoot well should be a requirement for getting a permit.
I'm going to have to disagree with you, even marksman miss targets sometimes. You have a crowded mall in panic, who knows. Just seeing someone else with a firearm was the last thing the shooter expected. If the shooter was directly in front of him and he was in a quick draw-shoot situation I have no doubt he would have taken out the suspect.
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Old 12-16-2012, 12:51   #8
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It doesn't say the bad guy saw the good guy.
If the bad guy didn't see the good guy's gun it wasn't a confutation.
Yes, it does say they saw each other.
Quote:
"I'm not beating myself up cause I didn't shoot him," said Meli. "I know after he saw me, I think the last shot he fired was the one he used on himself."
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Old 12-16-2012, 13:04   #9
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Originally Posted by SCmasterblaster View Post
The guy didn't shoot for he feared hitting an innocent person behind the criminal. Well if he is such a poor pistol shot, he shouldn't be carrying. Ability to shoot well should be a requirement for getting a permit.
That is arrogant and condescending to say the least.

Have you ever been in that exact situation? What was the distance between Meli and the shooter? How much time elapsed between when Meli took aim and saw the person behind the shooter? That person moved. Was it directional movement attempting to move away? Was it movement in place?

If anything Meli exhibited the exact discipline required to carry a firearm for self defense.
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Old 12-16-2012, 13:06   #10
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Originally Posted by RussP View Post
That is arrogant and condescending to say the least.

Have you ever been in that exact situation? What was the distance between Meli and the shooter? How much time elapsed between when Meli took aim and saw the person behind the shooter? That person moved. Was it directional movement attempting to move away? Was it movement in place?

If anything Meli exhibited the exact discipline required to carry a firearm for self defense.
+10...agreed
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Old 12-16-2012, 13:21   #11
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I think the CCW'r acted appropriately and I'm glad he was there to deter the shooter.

I noticed the national media didn't spend much time detailing the Oregon shooting. Now I know why.
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Old 12-16-2012, 13:22   #12
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Originally Posted by RussP View Post
Yes, it does say they saw each other.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulMason View Post

If the bad guy didn't see the good guy's gun it wasn't a confutation.
........
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Old 12-16-2012, 13:32   #13
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as much as i would have loved to read that he shot him,

i have to give him mad props for his control in deciding not to shot.
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Old 12-16-2012, 13:34   #14
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Originally Posted by SCmasterblaster View Post
The guy didn't shoot for he feared hitting an innocent person behind the criminal. Well if he is such a poor pistol shot, he shouldn't be carrying. Ability to shoot well should be a requirement for getting a permit.
Sorry, but one of the first basic rules of shooting safety is know your background. You don't shoot with innocent people directly behind your target. That applies to ANY shooting situation combat or otherwise.
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Old 12-16-2012, 13:40   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulMason View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by RussP View Post
Yes, it does say they saw each other.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulMason View Post

If the bad guy didn't see the good guy's gun it wasn't a confutation.
........
Follow the sequence:
  • Meli heard the gunfire.

  • Meli turned and saw the shooter.

  • Meli took cover behind a pillar.

  • Meli drew his pistol.

  • Meli lined up his shot.

  • Shooter with a jammed rifle saw Meli aiming at him.

  • Meli withdraws to a store.

  • Shooter leaves area without firing.

  • Meli thinks the shooter commits suicide with his next shot.
Do you read the sequence being different?
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Last edited by RussP; 12-16-2012 at 14:15..
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Old 12-16-2012, 14:18   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RussP View Post
Follow the sequence:
  • Meli heard the gunfire.
  • Meli turned and saw the shooter.
  • Meli took cover behind a pillar.
  • Meli drew his pistol.
  • Meli lined up his shot.
  • Shooter with a jammed rifle saw Meli aiming at him.
  • Meli withdraws to a store.
  • Shooter leaves area without firing.
  • Shooter commits suicide with his next shot.
Do you read the sequence being different?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulMason View Post

It doesn't say the bad guy saw the good guy.


If the bad guy didn't see the good guy's gun it wasn't a confutation.
Do I have to spell it out? No one can say what the bad guy saw - he is dead!

The good guy, as you say,
  • Meli took cover behind a pillar.
  • Meli drew his pistol.
also add doubt that the BG saw the GG and the gun.

Last edited by PaulMason; 12-16-2012 at 14:57..
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Old 12-16-2012, 14:33   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCmasterblaster View Post
The guy didn't shoot for he feared hitting an innocent person behind the criminal. Well if he is such a poor pistol shot, he shouldn't be carrying. Ability to shoot well should be a requirement for getting a permit.
it also requires being smart not stupid. killing the shooter but hitting someone else is not what CCW is about.

Do you even have a CCW?????
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Old 12-16-2012, 15:58   #18
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Originally Posted by PaulMason View Post
Do I have to spell it out? No one can say what the bad guy saw - he is dead!

The good guy, as you say,
  • Meli took cover behind a pillar.
  • Meli drew his pistol.
also add doubt that the BG saw the GG and the gun.
You left out
  • Meli lined up his shot.
meaning he aimed his pistol...

Meli is quoted as saying, "... I know after he saw me..."

How would Meli know the shooter saw him? Perhaps, just perhaps, he saw the shooter look at him while he was aiming.

What is your hesitance in accepting that Meli's presence may have stopped the shooter?
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Old 12-16-2012, 16:46   #19
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You left out
  • Meli lined up his shot.
meaning he aimed his pistol...

Meli is quoted as saying, "... I know after he saw me..."

How would Meli know the shooter saw him? Perhaps, just perhaps, he saw the shooter look at him while he was aiming.

What is your hesitance in accepting that Meli's presence may have stopped the shooter?
That the BG saw the GG. And, because Meli says the BG saw him, the BG ran away and shot himself.

Now it is possible that the BG & GG eyes did lock.

It isn't a big issue. It would have been a great story if the GG shot the BG to end the situation.

Did the stories mention the distance between the BG & GG & the gun the GG had?

Last edited by PaulMason; 12-16-2012 at 16:51..
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Old 12-16-2012, 16:48   #20
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Sorry, but one of the first basic rules of shooting safety is know your background. You don't shoot with innocent people directly behind your target. That applies to ANY shooting situation combat or otherwise.
Do you think that if the shooter had been firing on Meli that he would have held his fire and died bravely instead of risking hitting someone else by returning fire?
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Last edited by Dragoon44; 12-16-2012 at 16:49..
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