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Old 11-03-2013, 13:11   #41
OlliesRevenge
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Originally Posted by RussP View Post
You are the one who made the extraneous statements that changed the course of the discussion. Once the course change occurred, your continuing posts guaranteed the course would not correct back to the original.
My original post was only the third reply in the thread. There was no original course of conversation that we deviated from in a "course change". My post by no means prevented anyone else from offering their own original thoughts and commentary.

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Without the usual support, most don't like standing alone. There have even been suggestions that GT members in LE not be allowed to participate in this forum.
I don't mind standing alone. Excluding Civil Rights topics from GNG definitely stifled the dialogue in that area though.

The suggestion that law enforcement be excluded from participating in any forum is ridiculous. I find myself in vigorous debate most often with LEOs, neocons, and liberals (although liberals are somewhat rare here). It is the people we disagree with that challenge us the most, and make for the best learning experience. This is why I think the concept of an ignore list is ridiculous. It is the internet equivalent of plugging your fingers in your ears and saying "lalalalalala".

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The problem with trying to show you where you are wrong, I do not believe you are in any way capable of accepting that you might be wrong at anything...
You know its funny you say this, because I feel the exact same way about the law enforcement side. Whenever an incident gets posted in civil liberties, any critical thing that could be said is generally met with the argument that we are dealing with incomplete information, and making any judgement whatsoever is armchair quarterbacking, and that whatever happened must've happen for a good reason. I simply don't buy it, not all the time anyway.

I am only human, & I have a natural desire to be correct, but I assure you I am capable of honest self reflection and a change in my own beliefs and attitudes when necessary.

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Your comparison of the officer using pepper gas at UC Davis to Germans gassing Jews in your mind is perfectly correct. There is nothing wrong with that in your mind.
This is where the script gets flipped. I did not equate spraying college students with pepper spray to gassing jews. If you read my original post carefully this is clear.
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Old 11-03-2013, 14:18   #42
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Since I have this sense that you'll blow off the request for links to the sources for your specific incidents...This one...Pinellas Park man describes being blasted with Taser as he fought house fire?

What ever came out of that incident? Yes, you did have a few thoughts on that...Dorner's Last Day - Interesting Summary.

Correct me if those are the wrong incidents.
Yes those are the incidents I was referring to, there are many others I could have used as an example is well.

I have seen you do this before. Focus on minutia, ask multitudes of questions on tangential details, and obliviate any real discussion on the original topic.

Back on topic--

On balance.... weighing his actions vs what he went through, and with the knowledge that what he went through was a result of his actions, do you think it's reasonable that the UC Davis cop collected 38000 from l&i?
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Old 11-03-2013, 18:55   #43
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You are the one who made the extraneous statements that changed the course of the discussion. Once the course change occurred, your continuing posts guaranteed the course would not correct back to the original.
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Originally Posted by OlliesRevenge View Post
My original post was only the third reply in the thread.
It was the third, yes, but only the second relevant.
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Originally Posted by RussP View Post
You are the one who made the extraneous statements that changed the course of the discussion. Once the course change occurred, your continuing posts guaranteed the course would not correct back to the original.
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Originally Posted by OlliesRevenge View Post
There was no original course of conversation that we deviated from in a "course change".
The original course of conversation:
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Originally Posted by TBO View Post
UC Davis pepper spray cop gets $38G worker's compensation settlement

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/10/24...cmp=latestnews

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Something good came from OCing.

But seriously, sounds like the UC system knew they were wrong. And paid up to make this case go away. (And $38,000 is peanuts).
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You are the one who made the extraneous statements that changed the course of the discussion. Once the course change occurred, your continuing posts guaranteed the course would not correct back to the original.
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Originally Posted by OlliesRevenge View Post
My post by no means prevented anyone else from offering their own original thoughts and commentary.
That is not what I said, not even close.

Your "extraneous statements" in the original post: police violence against peaceful people, "the kind of stuff that makes good raw material for jokes, or comedy skits," the Nazis gassing Jews ( about which you later said, "When discussing a police use of force incident on GT any comparison must always come back to the Nazi's. You know this right?")

In your continuing posts...well, you know what you wrote, but this one stands out:
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But when push comes to shove, as this country continues to circle the drain, they will be required to be the tip of the spear for a twisted and desperate status quo.

"If tyranny comes to America, it will come in uniform". It is an old saw, but very true. At some point LEO's will have a big choice to make. If and when the big choice comes, I hope most choose to side with the people they serve!
Did you believe that would go unanswered? And you continued that thought later...
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Old 11-03-2013, 20:05   #44
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I don't mind standing alone. Excluding Civil Rights topics from GNG definitely stifled the dialogue in that area though.
Contrary to your understanding, and that of many others, of the original intent of GNG, now The Okie Corral, it was not opened for discussions of Civil Rights/Liberties.
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This is where the script gets flipped. I did not equate spraying college students with pepper spray to gassing jews. If you read my original post carefully this is clear.
Just the officer who committed violence, sprayed the peaceful protesters with pepper spray then suing the authorities who ordered him to is as funny as "a German soldier who was in charge of gassing Jews sued the German high command over the stress of hearing the screams of people down in the gas chamber\shower."

Following it later with, "When discussing a police use of force incident on GT any comparison must always come back to the Nazi's. You know this right?"

Of course you were not comparing the two...
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Old 11-03-2013, 20:26   #45
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Yes those are the incidents I was referring to, there are many others I could have used as an example is well.
What are your complaints about those in the fire/rescue services?
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I have seen you do this before. Focus on minutia, ask multitudes of questions on tangential details, and obliviate any real discussion on the original topic.
Questions are asked only to explore and clarify points raised and left open by others.
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Old 11-03-2013, 20:33   #46
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Back on topic--

On balance.... weighing his actions vs what he went through, and with the knowledge that what he went through was a result of his actions,
What are your sources for this information? Better we use the same sources.
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...do you think it's reasonable that the UC Davis cop collected 38000 from l&i?
Provide your information sources. We'll see if there is sufficient fact to decide the reasonableness of the award.
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Old 11-08-2013, 06:25   #47
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Quiet...
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Old 11-08-2013, 14:41   #48
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Quiet...
I didn't really consider there to be much to say.

What are my criticisms about the Fire Rescue Service you ask? A while back I created a thread titled "firefighters can be jerks too", about a fire captain who unnecessarily treated a member of the public like garbage ( but you already were aware of this thread) . I have had other private critical moments toward my own profession, but this is Glock talk, not nozzle talk, so the platform just isn't here for me to be critical about a bunch of marginal Fire Rescue incidents... Even though, rest assured, they do exist.
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Old 11-08-2013, 14:45   #49
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What are your sources for this information? Better we use the same sources.Provide your information sources. We'll see if there is sufficient fact to decide the reasonableness of the award.

I simply asked for an opinion on somebody else's part. What I got was smug condescension. Along with the typical strategy of focusing on minutia, asking multitudes of questions on tangential details, to obliviate the simple discussion at hand.

See you at the next thread.
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Old 11-22-2013, 23:13   #50
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Ollie

this is all you will get lol????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????

all you will get is a question with a question . search the forums you will see . also pm sent
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umm excuse me are those extragent circus pants you have on ?? or do you work for a circus ?

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Old 11-25-2013, 15:40   #51
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Ollie

this is all you will get lol????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????

all you will get is a question with a question . search the forums you will see . also pm sent


That's usually what happens when there's a discussion going on and one party has no idea what they'd talking about but presents their "opinion" as fact, even though it is based on no training or experience.
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Old 11-25-2013, 22:07   #52
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Originally Posted by OlliesRevenge View Post
Back on topic--

On balance.... weighing his actions vs what he went through, and with the knowledge that what he went through was a result of his actions,
Quote:
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What are your sources for this information? Better we use the same sources.
Ollie, you asked a question that included facts which I did not have. I simply asked you to share your info so we could talk using the same information.

You go on asking for a discussion about
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...do you think it's reasonable that the UC Davis cop collected 38000 from l&i?
Again, I do not have the details surround the grounds for awarding some sum of money to a State employee.So, I ask...
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What are your sources for this information? Better we use the same sources.Provide your information sources. We'll see if there is sufficient fact to decide the reasonableness of the award.
Another simple request for information I did not have.
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I simply asked for an opinion on somebody else's part.
And the 'somebody' asked for the same information you used to form your opinion.

To be real honest, what was in the linked news stories, that did not scratch the surface of facts needed for in informed opinion. They were barely superficial.

I was hoping you had found an internal info source, perhaps pych reports on the effects of the death threats, reports that would have been part of the State hearings to determine the value the officers pain and suffering.

Then there's the police reports on the threats. DO you have those? They would be part of the initial claims package. They ill definitely be in the settlement package, at least a summary.

See what happens when you ask for an opinion?

I don't know what information you have. Don't know what info you used to form your opinion. It isn't enough for me to form an opinion to publish on an open forum.
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What I got was smug condescension. Along with the typical strategy of focusing on minutia, asking multitudes of questions on tangential details, to obliviate the simple discussion at hand.

See you at the next thread.
Those questions, that minutia provides substantiation for my opinions. If you cannot, or just do not want to provide them, just say so.
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Old 11-26-2013, 00:32   #53
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That's usually what happens when there's a discussion going on and one party has no idea what they'd talking about but presents their "opinion" as fact, even though it is based on no training or experience.
didnt you read your sigline

and trust me you dont have alot of either . and its not rocket science .
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Old 11-26-2013, 01:33   #54
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didnt you read your sigline

and trust me you dont have alot of either . and its not rocket science .
Continuing your baseless insults and child like demeanor I see.

For a guy who never has anything of any substance or intelligence to add you're quite mouthy. But I digress, you did get a PM from me which you cowardly chose to ignore. Either way, I'm not going anywhere so you can either stop crying about it or put me on ignore.

You're right, it's not rocket science. It is a much more tangible discussion when discussed by guys who have BTDT.

I've never participated in "riot control" save for a few training exercises. We don't let things get out of hand like that.
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Old 11-26-2013, 01:35   #55
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Ollie, you asked a question that included facts which I did not have. I simply asked you to share your info so we could talk using the same information.

You go on asking for a discussion aboutAgain, I do not have the details surround the grounds for awarding some sum of money to a State employee.So, I ask...Another simple request for information I did not have.And the 'somebody' asked for the same information you used to form your opinion.

To be real honest, what was in the linked news stories, that did not scratch the surface of facts needed for in informed opinion. They were barely superficial.

I was hoping you had found an internal info source, perhaps pych reports on the effects of the death threats, reports that would have been part of the State hearings to determine the value the officers pain and suffering.

Then there's the police reports on the threats. DO you have those? They would be part of the initial claims package. They ill definitely be in the settlement package, at least a summary.

See what happens when you ask for an opinion?

I don't know what information you have. Don't know what info you used to form your opinion. It isn't enough for me to form an opinion to publish on an open forum.Those questions, that minutia provides substantiation for my opinions. If you cannot, or just do not want to provide them, just say so.

On its face, the award seems good to me.
Can the man work anywhere else?
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Old 11-26-2013, 07:06   #56
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On its face, the award seems good to me.
Can the man work anywhere else?
Perhaps not in law enforcement. I believe one of the State's stipulations in such cases is that the psychiatric injuries must be career ending. Thus, by accepting any settlement, the State employee would be unemployable in the field.

Without knowing how the threats against the officer were categorized and the resulting disability rated, other than "medium", if the state did not stipulate to "career ending disabilities," he might be able to work.

Would anyone hire him? That is another question...
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Old 11-26-2013, 17:45   #57
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Continuing your baseless insults and child like demeanor I see.

For a guy who never has anything of any substance or intelligence to add you're quite mouthy. But I digress, you did get a PM from me which you cowardly chose to ignore. Either way, I'm not going anywhere so you can either stop crying about it or put me on ignore.

You're right, it's not rocket science. It is a much more tangible discussion when discussed by guys who have BTDT.

I've never participated in "riot control" save for a few training exercises. We don't let things get out of hand like that.
who is crying ? i never said i want you to go anywhere , dunno where you got that idea, your diatribe posts are therapy for lots of gters . im happy you are here it would be boring without you my friend
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Old 11-26-2013, 18:16   #58
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Hey ASH, always remember that Santa is checking if you've been naughty or nice.

Robert.
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Old 11-26-2013, 19:11   #59
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Hey ASH, always remember that Santa is checking if you've been naughty or nice.

Robert.
that he is my friend . that he is
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