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Old 05-22-2013, 16:14   #1
cfr
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Another "this vs that" thread...

So I recently couldn't stand it anymore and sold my PPQ "classic". I'm likely not ever going to own very many pistols, and decided I want push button mag releases, that can be switched over for a lefty, on all of them.

I originally sold the Q to get a Q M2, but made the mistake of going online and into several shops just to make sure it's really what I wanted (I should have known better ).

I've ruled out all competition except for an M&P, either a Pro model (shorter barrel with night sights) or with an Apex trigger.

The ergos on the Q cannot be touched by anything in my hands. Between that and the awesome trigger, the PPQ shoots better for me than any other striker fired pistol I've ever shot. In fairness though, I have little experience with timers, etc. so I don't have much to compare it to in that regard.

The M&P brings less muzzle flip to the party. I do believe the Q has got a bad rap with all the "snappy", "wrist breaking", "violent recoil" internet claims, but to say it doesn't exist at all, when comparing to an M&P or Glock is simply to live in denial IMO.

While the M&P feels OK in my hands, it pales in comparison to the majestic wonder that is the PPQ grip, clearly inspired by the "Gods of ergos". It's also been rumored that even an Apex kit still isn't as good as the PPQ trigger, though I've never tried one.

Now my dilemma: Finding a place to rent both an M&P (either Pro model or with an Apex trigger) and a PPQ, both in 9MM, is going to be tough.

All said, what really matters more -- better ergos and trigger, or less muzzle flip? I know this will be subjective, but insight is still appreciated.

This gun will make it's living in home defense, classes, possibly low level competition, possible occasional carry, etc.

Thanks!
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Old 05-22-2013, 16:27   #2
Bruce M
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Trigger and grip would be more important to me.
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Old 05-22-2013, 16:30   #3
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Quote:
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Trigger and grip would be more important to me.
I agree with Bruce as usual!
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Old 05-22-2013, 16:51   #4
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IMNSHO "muzzle flip" is one of the most overrated issues discussed today.

The important parts all take place before the muzzle rises. How much it rises is, for the most part, affected by the shooter and their grip, balance, hand strength etc.

The time difference between two different guns in recoil is actually minimal especially when you consider the time lost if the "less flippy" gun requires a grip adjustment, or some other issue either on the way to the first shot or between shots.

It is a (sad) sign of our times that we concern ourselves more with how fast we can shoot more than we do with how fast, efficient, and effective our first shot is.

(Not a dig at the OP BTW just an observation about the shift in priorities)

At one time following shots were practiced because it was good to plan IN CASE of failure. Today we practice TO FAIL.
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Old 05-22-2013, 16:58   #5
cfr
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(Not a dig at the OP BTW just an observation about the shift in priorities)
No offense taken. I've only been shooting a few years, and am open to learning. Thanks.
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Old 05-22-2013, 20:51   #6
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The newer M&P triggers are pretty darn good so look out for one with the newer reset and pull. IMO, the M&P ergos are hands down perfect. I guess go with what you want, but check out the newer production M&Ps before making a decision and even then , the older models can be upgraded quite easily. The fact that the M&P is full on lefty friendly is a plus as well for those with that oddity.

BTW, I write lefty but shoot righty (thankfully)
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Old 05-22-2013, 21:44   #7
cfr
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nakanokalronin View Post
BTW, I write lefty but shoot righty (thankfully)
Yeah, you've got it made. I'm a total goofball with this stuff:

Pistol -- left handed
Rifle -- right
Baseball bat -- right
Write -- left
Boxing -- right (due to Filipino martial arts)


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Old 05-23-2013, 05:40   #8
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Trigger and grip would be more important to me.
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Old 05-23-2013, 05:45   #9
cfr
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That seems to be the recurring theme. I ran it by a buddy that's way in to USPSA competition, and without telling him either gun specifically, he immediately said "grip and trigger" as well.

Still open to more input, but honestly I didn't expect this thread to be this one-sided.
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Old 05-23-2013, 05:45   #10
45caldan
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PPQ!
The PPQ has THE BEST trigger of any sriker fired poly pistol!
The grip (for me) fits better than anything else as well.
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Old 05-23-2013, 21:01   #11
cfr
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Tough choice. I should add that this will be my last hand gun for the foreseeable future. If ammo ever loosens up, I want to focus more on training/ formal classes, as well as stocking up on some ammo. "Less guns and more training" is going to be my motto for the next 1 - 2 years.

Has anyone done a side by side with these two specific guns that would have some input?
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Old 05-24-2013, 17:17   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by countrygun View Post
IMNSHO "muzzle flip" is one of the most overrated issues discussed today.

The important parts all take place before the muzzle rises. How much it rises is, for the most part, affected by the shooter and their grip, balance, hand strength etc.

The time difference between two different guns in recoil is actually minimal especially when you consider the time lost if the "less flippy" gun requires a grip adjustment, or some other issue either on the way to the first shot or between shots.

It is a (sad) sign of our times that we concern ourselves more with how fast we can shoot more than we do with how fast, efficient, and effective our first shot is.

(Not a dig at the OP BTW just an observation about the shift in priorities)

At one time following shots were practiced because it was good to plan IN CASE of failure. Today we practice TO FAIL.
I totally concur with this sentiment.


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Old 05-24-2013, 17:56   #13
Pier23
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IMHO, you got rid of the best of the pack, the M1 PPQ which has a truly innovative mag system. Again, IMHO, if you liked the PPQ, then get another PPQ. It is a super piece.
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Old 05-24-2013, 18:04   #14
cfr
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IMHO, you got rid of the best of the pack, the M1 PPQ which has a truly innovative mag system. Again, IMHO, if you liked the PPQ, then get another PPQ. It is a super piece.


I'd say I'm really leaning towards an M2, and just covering my bases at this point.
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