GlockTalk.com
Home Forums Classifieds Blogs Today's Posts Search Social Groups



  
SIGN-UP
Notices

Glock Talk
Welcome To The Glock Talk Forums.

 
  
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-19-2013, 16:56   #521
WiskyT
Malcontent
 
WiskyT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 11,755
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stevekozak View Post
Where did you read that Grisham thinks that all police officers are cockroaches? The only cockroach reference that I have seen is in the blog that RussP posted and it is evident that Grisham is talking about folks in Temple TX, as he referenced "in this city". I have never been to Temple. Maybe the folks he is talking about are cockroaches. I don't know. I do know that he did not say all police officers are cockroaches, at least not in that article. If you have read otherwise, please post a link.
Really? Are you that incapable of comprehending his words, or are you deliberately trying to deny what he said?

Quote:
"...By delaying our ability to shed light upon the cockroaches infesting our city..."

Who do you think he was talking about here? Context is important. You were taught that in 3rd grade. He is involved in a dispute with LEOs in his city, in that context he refers to cockroaches in his city. Are you going to argue he was talking about the public works department? You might be trying to parse grishams words, but he isn't.
__________________
Drugs are bad because if you do drugs you're a hippie and hippies suck.
Eric Cartman


"If you kill enough of them, they stop fighting."-General Curtis E. LeMay
WiskyT is offline  
Old 05-19-2013, 17:03   #522
Gamma_Rat
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT View Post
Really? Are you that incapable of comprehending his words, or are you deliberately trying to deny what he said?




Who do you think he was talking about here? Context is important. You were taught that in 3rd grade. He is involved in a dispute with LEOs in his city, in that context he refers to cockroaches in his city. Are you going to argue he was talking about the public works department? You might be trying to parse grishams words, but he isn't.
I think you need to go back and reread the blog post. IIRC, he mentioned several examples of municipal employees before the "cockroach" comment.

This is what you said:

Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT
You walk hand in hand with a person who refers to all police officers as "cockroaches" and then you don't understand how you are offensive.
I don't know where you get that. It certainly isn't in the blog post. Perhaps you should think before you speak.
Gamma_Rat is offline  
Old 05-19-2013, 17:12   #523
WiskyT
Malcontent
 
WiskyT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 11,755
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamma_Rat View Post
I don't walk hand-in-hand with anyone. Ever.
You've been carrying grisham's water here all along. You claim you have criticisms of his actions, and then you go on to defend his actions. You and grisham are two sides of the same counterfeit coin.

Grisham acted like a twit. He got treated with courtesy and professionalism. I wouldn't have grabbed grisham's rifle. I would have ordered him to turn around and go prone. Any action other than that would have resulted in him being struck by my gunfire. It's as simple as that.

In a world where this is becoming more and more common, I wouldn't have been as understanding as the Temple PD Officers:


And, while you might not be intelligent to include incidents like the above shootout in the Officers' frame of mind when they secured grisham's rifle, you can be sure the judge that hears this case, if it even goes to trial, will.

Your complete lack of real world LE experience shows in the way you have no clue the amount of leeway courts award to Officers regarding their actions to make a scene safe. All the posters in here who have actual LE experience understand this and frankly have been goofing on you this whole time. This case wouldn't take up more than 30 minutes in a court before the judge ruled. You go into all of this goofy case law stuff, I'll tell you flat out that stuff only happens in watershead cases. No judge is going to allow constant motions on nonsense like you think is going to be heard.

An agitated man with a rifle in his hands, a 911 call, and a minor in possible danger, yeah, it's completely unreasonable for the Police to disarm the guy
__________________
Drugs are bad because if you do drugs you're a hippie and hippies suck.
Eric Cartman


"If you kill enough of them, they stop fighting."-General Curtis E. LeMay
WiskyT is offline  
Old 05-19-2013, 17:17   #524
WiskyT
Malcontent
 
WiskyT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 11,755
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamma_Rat View Post
I think you need to go back and reread the blog post. IIRC, he mentioned several examples of municipal employees before the "cockroach" comment.
You're correct. It is not LEO's he is disputing, it's the parks and recreation department that are a threat to his Rights
__________________
Drugs are bad because if you do drugs you're a hippie and hippies suck.
Eric Cartman


"If you kill enough of them, they stop fighting."-General Curtis E. LeMay
WiskyT is offline  
Old 05-19-2013, 17:39   #525
Gamma_Rat
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT View Post
You've been carrying grisham's water here all along. You claim you have criticisms of his actions, and then you go on to defend his actions. You and grisham are two sides of the same counterfeit coin.
I do have criticisms of Grisham. None of them involve a known violation of the law.

It may come as a shock to you, but unpopular lawful behavior is still lawful, and that's all that matters in a police/citizen encounter that involves a seizure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT
He got treated with courtesy and professionalism.
How do you know? We have to see the vid and hear the 911 call. I would hardly consider effecting an unlawful seizure to be professional behavior from a cop.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT
I wouldn't have grabbed grisham's rifle. I would have ordered him to turn around and go prone.
Based on what? Make an articulation that justifies seizure.









Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT
In a world where this is becoming more and more common, I wouldn't have been as understanding as the Temple PD Officers:



Caught On Cam - Police Traffic Stop Shooting With An AK47 - YouTube
You need to check the statistics. Last I looked, violence against police was not at all on the rise.

But, more to the point, you're being sensational. Spare me. Liberty is dangerous, but it's preferable to the alternative. We all take that risk.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT
And, while you might not be intelligent to include incidents like the above shootout in the Officers' frame of mind when they secured grisham's rifle, you can be sure the judge that hears this case, if it even goes to trial, will.
If a cop is wound that tight, perhaps he should seek some professional counseling. What we see in the video above is an outlier. This is simply not how so many police/citizen encounters go.

How often do you tremble and fret when you enter a school or go to the mall or a post office or a Luby's?

Give me a break.



Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT
Your complete lack of real world LE experience shows in the way you have no clue the amount of leeway courts award to Officers regarding their actions to make a scene safe.
Oh my. You don't think I understand exactly what our judiciary has done to our liberty?

I had to reread Arizona v. Gant about fifty times before I believed it. Scalia himself actually referred to the former bright line rule as a "charade." Given the trend in Fourth Amendment jurisprudence over that last forty years, I was floored to read this case.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT
All the posters in here who have actual LE experience understand this and frankly have been goofing on you this whole time. This case wouldn't take up more than 30 minutes in a court before the judge ruled. You go into all of this goofy case law stuff, I'll tell you flat out that stuff only happens in watershead cases. No judge is going to allow constant motions on nonsense like you think is going to be heard.
We'll see.

And I think we'll revisit this post.


Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT
An agitated man with a rifle in his hands, a 911 call, and a minor in possible danger, yeah, it's completely unreasonable for the Police to disarm the guy
Where do you see that the minor is possibly in danger?

Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT View Post
You're correct. It is not LEO's he is disputing, it's the parks and recreation department that are a threat to his Rights
He mentioned several folks. Not just cops. And he didn't make reference to "all" of them, either. You're just fabricating that.
Gamma_Rat is offline  
Old 05-19-2013, 17:59   #526
Sharky7
Boomshakalaka
 
Sharky7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 3,109
Grisham estimates 2 minutes of dash cam footage before his video starts.

That is a long time for an officer to exit a vehicle, greet him, and ask why he is carrying the rifle in his words.
Sharky7 is offline  
Old 05-19-2013, 18:07   #527
Gamma_Rat
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharky7 View Post
Grisham estimates 2 minutes of dash cam footage before his video starts.

That is a long time for an officer to exit a vehicle, greet him, and ask why he is carrying the rifle in his words.

Part of that time may be footage of the officer rolling up.
Gamma_Rat is offline  
Old 05-19-2013, 19:54   #528
RussP
Moderator
 
RussP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Central Virginia
Posts: 44,116
Blog Entries: 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamma_Rat View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT View Post
You've been carrying grisham's water here all along. You claim you have criticisms of his actions, and then you go on to defend his actions. You and grisham are two sides of the same counterfeit coin.
I do have criticisms of Grisham. None of them involve a known violation of the law.

It may come as a shock to you, but unpopular lawful behavior is still lawful, and that's all that matters in a police/citizen encounter that involves a seizure.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT
He got treated with courtesy and professionalism.
How do you know? We have to see the vid and hear the 911 call. I would hardly consider effecting an unlawful seizure to be professional behavior from a cop.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT
I wouldn't have grabbed grisham's rifle. I would have ordered him to turn around and go prone.
Based on what? Make an articulation that justifies seizure.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT
In a world where this is becoming more and more common, I wouldn't have been as understanding as the Temple PD Officers:

Caught On Cam - Police Traffic Stop Shooting With An AK47 - YouTube
You need to check the statistics. Last I looked, violence against police was not at all on the rise.

But, more to the point, you're being sensational. Spare me. Liberty is dangerous, but it's preferable to the alternative. We all take that risk.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT
And, while you might not be intelligent to include incidents like the above shootout in the Officers' frame of mind when they secured grisham's rifle, you can be sure the judge that hears this case, if it even goes to trial, will.
If a cop is wound that tight, perhaps he should seek some professional counseling. What we see in the video above is an outlier. This is simply not how so many police/citizen encounters go.

How often do you tremble and fret when you enter a school or go to the mall or a post office or a Luby's?

Give me a break.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT
Your complete lack of real world LE experience shows in the way you have no clue the amount of leeway courts award to Officers regarding their actions to make a scene safe.
Oh my. You don't think I understand exactly what our judiciary has done to our liberty?

I had to reread Arizona v. Gant about fifty times before I believed it. Scalia himself actually referred to the former bright line rule as a "charade." Given the trend in Fourth Amendment jurisprudence over that last forty years, I was floored to read this case.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT
All the posters in here who have actual LE experience understand this and frankly have been goofing on you this whole time. This case wouldn't take up more than 30 minutes in a court before the judge ruled. You go into all of this goofy case law stuff, I'll tell you flat out that stuff only happens in watershead cases. No judge is going to allow constant motions on nonsense like you think is going to be heard.
We'll see.

And I think we'll revisit this post.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT
An agitated man with a rifle in his hands, a 911 call, and a minor in possible danger, yeah, it's completely unreasonable for the Police to disarm the guy
Where do you see that the minor is possibly in danger?
Quote:
Originally Posted by WiskyT View Post
You're correct. It is not LEO's he is disputing, it's the parks and recreation department that are a threat to his Rights
He mentioned several folks. Not just cops. And he didn't make reference to "all" of them, either. You're just fabricating that.
For the record...
__________________
Freedom has a taste to those who fight and almost die, that the protected will never know.

"Comment is free, but facts are sacred." C.P. Scott, 1921
RussP is offline  
Old 05-19-2013, 20:36   #529
RussP
Moderator
 
RussP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Central Virginia
Posts: 44,116
Blog Entries: 64
When there is new information, new factual information, we'll start a new thread.

Honestly, I have no more patience, no tolerance left for the ignorant crap being posted. I'm tired of sending messages to members telling them, warning them not to respond to some of the trolling language in some posts in this thread. I thank all for your cooperation...proud of you.

Like I said, if there is real honest to goodness "NEW" news, we'll start a new thread.
__________________
Freedom has a taste to those who fight and almost die, that the protected will never know.

"Comment is free, but facts are sacred." C.P. Scott, 1921
RussP is offline  

 
  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:02.




Homepage
FAQ
Forums
Calendar
Advertise
Gallery
GT Wiki
GT Blogs
Social Groups
Classifieds


Users Currently Online: 709
158 Members
551 Guests

Most users ever online: 2,244
Nov 11, 2013 at 16:42