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Old 03-22-2013, 09:03   #26
tarpleyg
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Originally Posted by jame View Post
I understand that. But that doesn't squelch my concerns when I find out that my son in law gets home from work and throws his compact nine on the kitchen counter as he heads for the shower. I have a six year old grandson, and his injury would crush me.

I bought him a small safe, and understand that he's using it, but how many more little kids may be at risk? Or is that, too, "Not my problem?"

I fear, sooner or later, it will be all of our problem.
Well, instead of *****ing about it here on GT, why not talk to your SIL about it and educate him? That's the first step I'd take. We're all teachers of something in life. If this is a concern for you start teaching people about gun safety. this should include children too just like your grandson. My 5 year old daughter knows the Eddie Eagle rules and my almost-2-year-old is now learning that stuff too. I don't always leave my guns out but when I do, they have been triple checked and they know not to touch them. That's not often but sometimes I have to get at something in the safe and the long guns have to be laid out on the bed. I don't hide my guns from them and I encourage them to ask questions about them.
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Old 03-22-2013, 09:10   #27
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There's never been a shortage of irresponsible people.

These people do all kinds of things that put others at risk. Drinking and driving. Driving without regard for the safety of others even if not drinking. Heavy machinery. Toying with explosives they learned how to make on the internet.

The list of things people do that put others in danger is so long I'm sure it would stagger the imagination of even the most creative mind.

Yes, we'll eventually hear of incidents from these newfound firearm owners. Not because they're new or anything special related to the frenzy of buying - but because they are people. There are simply some people who are an accident waiting to happen.

So do I worry about them? Yes. But no more than I would concern myself over any normal gun owner.

I'm far more concerned, for my own safety and the safety of my family, with the idiot hunter who shoots are bushes when the wind blows. There's no shortage of those idiots and they are generally male and grew up around and are well educated in the safety of firearms. They simply choose to ignore that education and be stupid.

I'm also more concerned with the guy on the highway swirving into my lane while texting or changing a radio station.
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Old 03-22-2013, 09:10   #28
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Waiting for the inevitable driving and owning an automobile comparison...
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Old 03-22-2013, 09:12   #29
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This sounds a lot like the generational arguements that often arise here......... " what wrong with todays generation"..... not as - - fill in the blank - - as previous generations.

Why should we (us older or more experienced folks) think we are any more or less safe when we started out in firearms those starting today.

Sounds strange to me. I suspect, this new group is probably no less safe or likely to create a risk than when you - all started.
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Old 03-22-2013, 09:17   #30
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Personal Responesability comes to mind.
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Old 03-22-2013, 09:22   #31
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Originally Posted by Rotn1 View Post
This sounds a lot like the generational arguements that often arise here......... " what wrong with todays generation"..... not as - - fill in the blank - - as previous generations.

Why should we (us older or more experienced folks) think we are any more or less safe when we started out in firearms those starting today.

Sounds strange to me. I suspect, this new group is probably no less safe or likely to create a risk than when you - all started.
I think too many gun owners want to appear reasonable to non-owners. It's reasonable to want everyone to be safe. Therefore, its reasonable to require it. We have all watched as government and society has chipped away at personal responsibility and has attempted to protect the individual from themselves in every way shape or form.

I can understand wanting a family member protected from harm. I cannot understand wanting the government to force that protection.
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Old 03-22-2013, 09:38   #32
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This is an issue of responsibility.

Children cannot legally buy or own guns until they are at least 18 years of age, to the best of my knowledge.

I know some gun owners train their kids how to safely handle firearms,and in some parts of the country (mostly rural areas) the culture surrounding guns is totally different than it is in others.

I know folks who take their kids hunting and trust them fully with their firearms, which is absolutely fantastic.

However, the fact remains that adults are responsible for their firearms and IMHO, should be held accountable for their failure to secure them.

Losing a child is a horrible event.
My sister lost her 9 year old son two weeks before his 10th birthday to cancer many years ago and she still isn't over it and I believe if it had been due to something that was preventable it would have been even harder for her to cope with.
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Old 03-22-2013, 09:42   #33
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So, should the government be involved in mandating that gun owners recieve training?

I'm all for people getting the training they need. I think for CCW permits, an applicant should demonstrate safety, and their ability to shoot a reasonable course of fire if they want to carry a firearm in public.

But, I'm against the government being involved in mandatory training, to their standards to own a firearm.
Arizona has had constitutional carry for a few years now. I think we have the same amount of idiots carrying concealed guns as we always did. Training doesn't fix stupid.

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Old 03-22-2013, 09:44   #34
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Does it make me an irresponsible gun owner if I leave multiple loaded, mostly unchambered, firearms around my house unsecured? I have no children. No children are ever visiting my home.
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Old 03-22-2013, 09:55   #35
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Does it make me an irresponsible gun owner if I leave multiple loaded, mostly unchambered, firearms around my house unsecured? I have no children. No children are ever visiting my home.

Yes. They all should be chambered.
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Old 03-22-2013, 09:56   #36
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Pssssssst , We were all newbs at one time..! Shhhhh..!
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Old 03-22-2013, 10:05   #37
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Gun responsibility is a right of passage. Fathers/Mothers to their children, so on and so forth. For those whose mom or dad didn't own guns and are really brand new to guns, then learn "The Gun Safety Rules" we all learned, beyond this, there is no need for any additional anything for new gun owners and I simply say practice, practice, and practice some more.

The Four Rules by Colonel Jeff Cooper:
  1. All guns are always loaded.
  2. Never let the muzzle cover anything you are not willing to destroy.
  3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on the target.
  4. Be sure of your target and what is beyond it.
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Old 03-22-2013, 10:12   #38
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We were all new gun owners at one time.
I am sure there are a few people that have only bought used guns...


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Old 03-22-2013, 10:22   #39
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Check out this video and pass it on to your SIL so they can watch it with your grandson...


It's one of the Eddie Eagle videos. If you find the right link, you might be able to get some Eddie Eagle materials like coloring books and stickers. I got a bunch of stuff free, shared it with my kids and took them shooting with me. We blew up a watermelon that they had drawn faces on, so they knew what the gun could do if they weren't careful. They both have been shooting since they were VERY young. My daughter was 7, my son was 2/3 when they were first introduced to guns.
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Old 03-22-2013, 10:36   #40
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Instead of requiring training, if that offends you, why not offer an incentive to new CCW applicants by saying "If you complete state approved training course ABC, the term of your permit will be 4 years instead of the standard 3. If you complete courses ABC and XYZ, your permit will be effective for 5 years. There will be no additional permit fees for the extended terms."

I suspect many new gun owners don't have mentors to teach them the rules and coach them in basic handling techniques. I don't have the answers, but I do believe learning 4 basic safety rules falls far short of adequate training, especially with handguns.

If a person new to firearms lacks adequate training, he may teach himself some very bad habits. Extensive practice of bad techniques can lead to unsafe performance thats very hard to unlearn.

Last edited by PhotoFeller; 03-22-2013 at 10:44..
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Old 03-22-2013, 10:37   #41
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Those people are the reason why I rather be at the range alone. I don't have to worry about getting shot by anyone other than myself.
These people are the reason I am glad to have my OWN range!
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Old 03-22-2013, 10:45   #42
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I understand that. But that doesn't squelch my concerns when I find out that my son in law gets home from work and throws his compact nine on the kitchen counter as he heads for the shower. I have a six year old grandson, and his injury would crush me.

I bought him a small safe, and understand that he's using it, but how many more little kids may be at risk? Or is that, too, "Not my problem?"

I fear, sooner or later, it will be all of our problem.
I would have a serious conversation with your son in law about safe storage of his pistol around the kids. That is totally irresponsible and negligent on his part.
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Old 03-22-2013, 10:49   #43
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Originally Posted by jame View Post
I understand that. But that doesn't squelch my concerns when I find out that my son in law gets home from work and throws his compact nine on the kitchen counter as he heads for the shower. I have a six year old grandson, and his injury would crush me.

I bought him a small safe, and understand that he's using it, but how many more little kids may be at risk? Or is that, too, "Not my problem?"

I fear, sooner or later, it will be all of our problem.
The safe slows you down to defend an intruder in your house. It's not worth it. Train everyone in family. Past in America, almost everyone knew how to handle the gun. Liberals has won in this battle.
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Old 03-22-2013, 10:53   #44
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This country is full of people who want to control others..It's each individuals job to understand the safety and responsibilities of gun ownership. If they choose not to use common sense then so be it. If i see unsafe gun handling or other stupidity I usually say something and then remove myself from the situation. I don't actively engage with new shooters who can't grasp basic safety and will leave a range if I see unsafe handling which isn't corrected by the staff.
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Old 03-22-2013, 10:56   #45
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The safe slows you down to defend an intruder in your house. It's not worth it. Train everyone in family. Past in America, almost everyone knew how to handle the gun. Liberals has won in this battle.
Sometimes my five granddaughters, ages 3 to 13, have a hard time understanding proper stance (Isosceles? Weaver? Variation?), clearing jams, quick mag changes, etc. I'm thinking the safe is a good idea for a few more years.

Last edited by PhotoFeller; 03-22-2013 at 11:35..
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Old 03-22-2013, 11:01   #46
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And this is why all guns should be banned!
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Old 03-22-2013, 11:05   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhotoFeller View Post
Instead of requiring training, if that offends you, why not offer an incentive to new CCW applicants by saying "If you complete state approved training course ABC, the term of your permit will be 4 years instead of the standard 3. If you complete courses ABC and XYZ, your permit will be effective for 5 years. There will be no additional permit fees for the extended terms."
No. The next time those who want to ban guns get majority, they eliminate the option. It's much easier to change a law than get a restrictive one passed. So, no.

Let the State stay out of training requirements and push for repeal of those State laws that have them now.
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Old 03-22-2013, 11:14   #48
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Originally Posted by GLWyandotte View Post
We were all new gun owners at one time.
Yep, we were.
I remember when i first started CCing I was absolutely CONVINCED that i was printing and that everyone knew I had a gun and that I was going to be stopped by a police officer.
I also thought that I was going to set off alarms in stores and libraries.

Now, its as much a part of my daily routine as putting on my tie.
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Old 03-22-2013, 11:28   #49
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We were all new gun owners at one time.
Yes but some of us had Fathers around to teach us and we grew up knowing the rules and safe handling. I see what the OP is concerned about. There are a lot of people who are into adulthood and practically buying the first gun they've ever touched. It is foolishness not to be a bit concerned, I know the media gets concerned when they have an accident and then that concerns a lot of voters, maybe even influences them.

Some of us have taken steps like making sure our LGS is well stocked with free handouts about gun safety and safe handling. Our only LGS around here is very good about helping newbies and they have called me at home and ask me to come down and bring a couple of mine to help instruct first-time buyers who way want to order something that I happen to have.

Just saying "Oh well, they'll learn" is something I can't feel good about sitting still and saying.

Last edited by countrygun; 03-22-2013 at 11:29..
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Old 03-22-2013, 11:32   #50
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I hate to be indelicate, because we're all "2nd Amendment, HELL YEAH!" around here, but is anyone mildly concerned about some of the new gun owners that have zero experience with firearms?

I've talked a bit with some of the guys at my local place of business, and they say they do. My concern is that the new guy is going to come home from work and throw his loaded G26 in his sock drawer when he gets home, without a second thought that his 6 year old will get his hands on it.

Has anyone else had the same thoughts?
Join the NRA (if you haven't already) and get certified as a basic pistol instructor. Then offer classes, not for profit, and try to help people, and help spread the word.

A lot of people are new shooters looking for help. The more we make the educational resources available, the more they will be utilized.

I know that you know of some hard core guy who won't take any gun safey tips from anyone. But that shouldn't stop us from helping those who are actually open to learning more about shooting and about safety.

Last edited by ithaca_deerslayer; 03-22-2013 at 11:33..
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