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Old 02-24-2013, 18:33   #21
SCmasterblaster
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fastbolt View Post
Funny you should mention the Rem grn/wht box 115gr +P+ LE Only loads.

I was moving around some boxes earlier this morning and I found 3 boxes (50/ct) of that ammo hidden behind some other ammo.

I sort of recall having briefly used it for range/qual ammo sometime about 10-15 years ago.

I also found some Starfire, early production Rem Bonded, some frangible and some Speer GDHP I'd forgotten I'd had (a few different loadings/calibers) ... and a surprising amount of some Fed Nyclad.

I really should get organized some day.
I use 9mm 115gr +P+ JHPs in my G17 - 1400 FPS!
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Old 02-25-2013, 02:50   #22
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Funny you should mention the Rem grn/wht box 115gr +P+ LE Only loads.

I was moving around some boxes earlier this morning and I found 3 boxes (50/ct) of that ammo hidden behind some other ammo.

I sort of recall having briefly used it for range/qual ammo sometime about 10-15 years ago....

and a surprising amount of some Fed Nyclad...

The last time I shot +p+ Rem. was in 1999.

I was never that enthusiastic for the Nyclad as they were creampuff. The old +p 158 Nyclad didn't break 700 fps in some snubbies!! Felt like Droopy Dog throwing a rock.

What I'd really like to find again is an old box of the early Corbon .38 Special +p 158 gr. SWCLHP as those did an honest 1k fps out of a snubby and had softer lead than Buffalo Bore's modern incarnation if I recall rightly.
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Old 02-25-2013, 22:05   #23
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This thread is very interesting. Thanks for showing your results fellows.
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Old 02-26-2013, 08:08   #24
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The last time I shot +p+ Rem. was in 1999.

I was never that enthusiastic for the Nyclad as they were creampuff. The old +p 158 Nyclad didn't break 700 fps in some snubbies!! Felt like Droopy Dog throwing a rock.

What I'd really like to find again is an old box of the early Corbon .38 Special +p 158 gr. SWCLHP as those did an honest 1k fps out of a snubby and had softer lead than Buffalo Bore's modern incarnation if I recall rightly.
CorBon makes some excellent ammo.
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Old 02-26-2013, 09:24   #25
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I don't buy the ammo but do get the bullets for reloading and fine them to be very good bullets. I would and have trusted them as carry ammo.
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Old 02-26-2013, 09:52   #26
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All in all I think it's solid ammo. Perhaps there are some lots that do better than others, but I've always gotten jacket core separation with the 180gr GS, but not with the 165gr version.
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Old 02-26-2013, 11:35   #27
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All in all I think it's solid ammo. Perhaps there are some lots that do better than others, but I've always gotten jacket core separation with the 180gr GS, but not with the 165gr version.
That's odd. I would expect separation more with the shorter, faster bullet.
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Old 02-28-2013, 22:43   #28
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fastbolt,

Thanks for posting that picture of the 4 layer denim and 165gr. Golden Saber into the gel block. Great! Any idea at what depth the jacket separated? It looks to have still gotten good penetration.

I reload and it's one of the best bullets for reloading. You can't get most other "premium" bullets.
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Old 03-01-2013, 00:44   #29
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I know next to nothing about .40S&W but I have come to believe that Remington Golden Saber Bonded is the Rodney Dangerfield of JHP ammos, as tnoutdoors describes it. Those who have tested it reveal excellent results and convinced me to pick some of it up several months back.

I used to carry the Golden Saber 124-grain +P in my 9mm because it yielded the best overall shooting characteristics of all the premium JHP ammos I tested. I moved away from it after reading too many core/jacket separation testimonials. That said, I have high hopes for the Bonded version and from the video tests I've seen it's an under-appreciated round for what the end results demonstrate.

tnoutdoors tests have (from memory) shown the
9mm
124-grain Golden Saber +P Bonded delivering 12" penetration with excellent expansion and 125-grain
penetration of 14" with similar expansion stats, both with impressive wound track numbers. That makes me inclined to think Golden Saber Bonded rounds in other calibers are something to seriously consider --- if you can find any at this point in time.
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Old 03-01-2013, 02:25   #30
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fastbolt,

Thanks for posting that picture of the 4 layer denim and 165gr. Golden Saber into the gel block. Great! Any idea at what depth the jacket separated? It looks to have still gotten good penetration.

I reload and it's one of the best bullets for reloading. You can't get most other "premium" bullets.
As I recall, we were using 18" gel blocks, and you can see the entire block. We weren't doing digital video (just stills), so the precise instant in which the jacket was shed by the core wasn't recorded, although you can see where it stopped.
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Old 03-01-2013, 08:02   #31
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It is pretty nice as a component 180 grain bullet when loaded to about 1250 fps in 10mm.
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Old 03-01-2013, 08:58   #32
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It is pretty nice as a component 180 grain bullet when loaded to about 1250 fps in 10mm.
Awesome!
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Old 03-01-2013, 10:15   #33
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nice pics in this thread
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Old 03-01-2013, 15:03   #34
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I've seen too many Golden Saber's shed their jackets in testing. I prefer the bonded version. But odds are the non-bonded will work fine, though I wouldn't want to use it through a serious barrier (let's not get into the barrier shootings topic here).
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Old 03-02-2013, 00:32   #35
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Wow, what a great response !
...and I got more...
Gun-Test Febuary 2013 issue rates:
Test gun Glock 23, shot into water...
165gr.Remington Golden Saber,
1093 fps, 438 ft/lbs .71 expansion, 97% weight retention, 18" penetration,($1.36/round) ("A-" rating)
Black Hills
180gr. 1009 fps, 406 ft/lbs, .70" expansion, 100% wt. retention, 20" penetration,(84cent/round) ("A" rating)...
Black Hills 155gr, 1123 fps, 438 ft/lbs, .71", 18", 100%, (84 cents/ round)("A" rating)...
Winchester PDX1 Defender 165gr, 1101 fps, 444 ft/lbs,.72", 100%, 16"($1.05/rd) ("A" rating)...
Federal Hydra Shok 155gr, 1072 fps, 395 ft/lbs, .70", 100%, 17", (A-)...
Corbon 135gr, 1338 fps, 536 ft/lbs, .60", 52% weight retention, 12" ($1.38/rd) (A-)...
Corbon DPX 140gr, 1175 fps, 429 ft/lbs, .69", 100%, 18", ($1.80/rd), ("B")...
Hornady Critical Defense 165gr, FTX, 1067 fps, 417 ft/lbs, .70", 99%, 16", $1.00, B+...
Mag tech Guardian Gold 180gr, 1009, 406, .70", 100%, 20", B, 98 cents





Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire
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Old 03-03-2013, 14:16   #36
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I have forgotten - do any of the major cartridge makers offer a +p .40 S&W round?
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Old 08-11-2013, 04:02   #37
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Forgive the ignorance as I am still new with the 40 SW caliber.Anyway,for a defense load,what would be better to get,a 40 SW in 165 GR. or 180 GR.?And why?Also,does the 165 GR. 40 SW caliber have so much more kick than the 180 GR.?
Thanks.
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Old 08-11-2013, 07:19   #38
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The 165 grain loads are generally loaded hot. Bear in mind though, that Speer offers its Gold Dot 165 in two power levels, so you have to pay attention to which one you are buying. The hot Speer 165 load actually chipped a small piece of the slide rail of my G27. Those suckers are HOT.

The 180 grain loads at ~1000 fps are more docile, thus are easier to control and are what I carry now in my 27.
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Old 08-11-2013, 08:53   #39
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great rounds until i watched youtube 40 cal test and saw the 165gr gold dots, check out tnnoutdoors testing
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Old 08-11-2013, 21:09   #40
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I have forgotten - do any of the major cartridge makers offer a +p .40 S&W round?
No. The S.A.A.M.I. pressure limit for the .40 S&W is set at 241.32 MPa (35,000 psi), piezo pressure. Additionally, S.A.A.M.I does not list a +P or +P+ charge for the .40 S&W. None of the major ammunition manufactures market a .40 S&W +P as it does not officially exist. There are problems loading the cartridge to max pressure or beyond due to case head rupture or case mouth splits. Additional problems are bullet set back causing excessive pressure, unsupported chambers causing case head rupture or not enough case web support (Federal Pre-1995). If you want a hot load for the 40 S&W buy a 10 MM and call it a day. That is why I own a G20 SF with a conversion barrel for 40 S&W and have encountered no issues.
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