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Old 02-21-2013, 20:15   #26
Arc Angel
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Originally Posted by BMiracletx View Post
Once again the Arc Angel wisdom shines through. Agree 100%.
Unexpected compliments are always the best to receive. Thank you for that!

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Originally Posted by atcs2152 View Post
I'm glad you suggested that because that brings up another newbie question: I'm not sure how to do that. I noticed yesterday that if I insert a loaded magazine with the slide closed, the magazine won't go all the way in and latch. If I insert the loaded magazine with the slide open, of course it goes all the way and latches but I'll end up chambering a round when I close the slide. What am I missing?
Gooo ..... d question!

I'm going to talk to you now like the old man that I am rather than the young man that I'd like to be.

Brand new Glocks often have difficulty seating a fully loaded magazine. New magazine springs need to, 'take a set'. What many people do is to fully load a magazine and leave it that way for up to an entire week. After a few days that fully loaded magazine will take a, 'working set'; the top cartridge will drop down lower in the magazine; and the magazine will fit better into the frame.

After 60 + years of gun-handling I think it safe to say that, 'I've seen it all.' I do NOT ever load my self-defense carry magazines to full capacity. Why? Because, over the years, I've both seen and experienced too many fully loaded semiautomatic pistols either fail-to-feed, or fail-to-extract.

Semi-autos simply work better when the magazine isn't fully loaded. Consequently, all of my EDC semiautomatic pistols are downloaded by one round. All of my tactical carbine magazines are, also, downloaded by two to three rounds.

How often does this happen? Well, in ten years of extensive use I have jammed a Glock pistol exactly three times - ALL of these FTF's or, FTE's occurred when the Glock I was using was loaded to full magazine capacity + one; and it was always the top round in the magazine that caused the jam!

Your Glock is brand new. It needs to be, 'verified' or, 'shot in'. Until you've put, at the very least, 250 fired rounds through that gun, you should expect it to be a little finicky, and something less than 100% reliable. (It's only a plastic frame pistol!)

For the time being I suggest that you do not fully load your inserted magazines. Right now, download by one or two rounds and everything will go together nicely. How you load your magazines later on is entirely up to you.



NOTE: Another reason, 'Why' I don't run full magazines is because fully loaded magazines - and, especially, fully loaded magazines + one - beat the Hell out of the top edge of the magazine's retention notch.
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Old 02-21-2013, 20:23   #27
BMiracletx
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Originally Posted by Arc Angel View Post
Unexpected compliments are always the best to receive. Thank you for that!



Gooo ..... d question!

I'm going to talk to you now like the old man that I am rather than the young man that I'd like to be.

Brand new Glocks often have difficulty seating a fully loaded magazine. New magazine springs need to, 'take a set'. What many people do is to fully load a magazine and leave it that way for up to an entire week. After a few days that fully loaded magazine will take a, 'working set'; the top cartridge will drop down lower in the magazine; and the magazine will fit better into the frame.

After 60 + years of gun-handling I think it safe to say that, 'I've seen it all.' I do NOT ever load my self-defense carry magazines to full capacity. Why? Because, over the years, I've both seen and experienced too many fully loaded semiautomatic pistols either fail-to-feed, or fail-to-extract.

Semi-autos simply work better when the magazine isn't fully loaded. Consequently, all of my EDC semiautomatic pistols are downloaded by one round. All of my tactical carbine magazines are, also, downloaded by two to three rounds.

How often does this happen? Well, in ten years of extensive use I have jammed a Glock pistol exactly three times - ALL of these FTF's or, FTE's occurred when the Glock I was using was loaded to full magazine capacity + one; and it was always the top round in the magazine that caused the jam!

Your Glock is brand new. It needs to be, 'verified' or, 'shot in'. Until you've put, at the very least, 250 fired rounds through that gun, you should expect it to be a little finicky, and something less than 100% reliable. (It's only a plastic frame pistol!)

For the time being I suggest that you do not fully load your inserted magazines. Right now, download by one or two rounds and everything will go together nicely. How you load your magazines later on is entirely up to you.



NOTE: Another reason, 'Why' I don't run full magazines is because fully loaded magazines - and, especially, fully loaded magazines + one - beat the Hell out of the top edge of the magazine's retention notch.
See... its posts like this from you that I enjoy reading! You always seem to have the time, patience, and a mix of rational AND personal experiences to share with others! Arc Angel, you are Da GlockMeister!
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Old 02-21-2013, 20:31   #28
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All locked and loaded, at home, in my safe, in my SUV, in my pocket, IWB, OSWB, shoulder holster or where ever! I have no children or grand children at home!

I clean and rotate often. And, I wipe them down when I touch the metal.
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Old 02-21-2013, 20:39   #29
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ATCS, here's another angle on the scenario. If you hear a noise in the night, your plan is to insert a loaded mag and then drop the slide to chamber a round. But in the several times I've been awoken by a midnight crash, the LAST thing I wanted was to announce where in the house I was with a loud SNAP of a slide slamming home. In fact, I want it perfectly quiet so I can dial in where the noise came from and what it might be. I don't want noise near me(namely, the wife asking questions ) because I want to hear it again. Making noise with your pistol not only masks other important sounds, it tells any person in your house exactly where you are. And please, let's not debate the MYTH that the sound of a shotgun racking will send burglars running for their lives. That's a wives tale and a foolish gun-store anecdote that lulls newbies into feeling secure with an unloaded shotgun (or pistol in this case).

All guns in various locations in my house are loaded. Always. My wife and kids know that and handle them accordingly. If there's a crash in the night I want my guns to be loaded, silent and ready for use. I don't understand the desire to store a locked, unloaded pistol. You might not have the time to make that thing ready for the fight. It's the reason I like Glocks. Pick one up and it's go time. One man's opinion only.
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Last edited by Opie 1 Kenopie; 02-21-2013 at 20:39..
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Old 02-21-2013, 20:48   #30
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When I went to the police academy in 1992 they would store our firearms, including my personally owned Glock 17 with the slide locked open. I did not like it at all then, my older and even more obsessive self would replace the recoil spring.
So, no I would not store it with the slide locked open.
Hypotrically, I do keep a 1911 in condition 1, but I shoot it with some degree of frequency and replace the mainspring if the primer doesn't display a positive enough impact for my picky self.
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Old 02-22-2013, 16:31   #31
atcs2152
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Thanks for the advice folks. I've offloaded a single round and I'm now storing it with an almost full magazine with the chamber empty. Only thing is, now it's too heavy. JUST KIDDING. On a serious note though, I remember a scene in one of the Bourne movies where another assassin grabs a handgun from the freezer and Bourne comments that the guy didn't detect that it was too light, hence empty, because Bourne had already emptied it. At the time I wondered if that was possible. Now I know.
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Old 02-23-2013, 05:16   #32
Arc Angel
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Originally Posted by atcs2152 View Post
Thanks for the advice folks. I've offloaded a single round and I'm now storing it with an almost full magazine with the chamber empty. Only thing is, now it's too heavy. JUST KIDDING. On a serious note though, I remember a scene in one of the Bourne movies where another assassin grabs a handgun from the freezer and Bourne comments that the guy didn't detect that it was too light, hence empty, because Bourne had already emptied it. At the time I wondered if that was possible. Now I know.
A, too often, common movie mistake that I recall seeing in a number of different movies. 'The Bourne Ultimatum', and, 'Taken' are among them. (It isn't just the weight of the pistol that gives this away; the whole balance of a piece is thrown off when the grip is too light in weight.)

I think that if you teach yourself to consistently react as if, 'The gun is always loaded.' then you'll be fine from now on. All ya got 'a remember is that (for ALL handling purposes) THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS AN EMPTY GUN - EVER!

The other great mistake I've learned far too many people make is they seem to have some sort of perverse fascination with pulling the trigger. I've talked to and corresponded with a lot of people who have ND'd their Glocks. The vast majority of them, 'let one loose' preparatory to (1) taking the slide off the frame, or (2) pulling the trigger in order to, 'make the gun safe'.

To my mind, the greatest danger to using a semiautomatic pistol is the, all too common, mistake of dropping the magazine while completely overlooking the fact that there's still a hot round left in the chamber! (Happens much too often!)

I'm one of very few people who saw the first, UN:EDITED, Lee Paige ND video. It was actually a much more serious gun-handling mistake than was admitted to, later on. In the original video what Lee Paige and his other DEA pal did was to clear the pistol by: (1) partially dropping the magazine, (2) racking the slide, (3) ejecting a live round, and (4) then locking the slide to the rear.

What happened next is mind-numbing! These two - two! - DEA agents watched each other while Paige slapped the magazine back into its locked position, and used the slide stop to snap the slide home. (Rechambering another live round to replace the one they'd just removed!)

Those two DEA agents - NOT just Lee Paige - broke so many firearm-handling safety rules that, had they actually been certified NRA Instructors, they would have lost their credentials! The mistakes are numerous:

(1) They brought both guns AND live ammunition into the same classroom/demonstration area. (You don't do that!)

(2) Two agents, acting in concert with each other, removed a fully loaded weapon from its holster. (You don't do that, either!)

(3) This fully loaded weapon was, then, cleared in the most ludicrous manner I have ever seen! (These two men were BOTH poorly trained, rank amateur gun-handlers, sporting a: real, live, fully loaded, and ready-to-go (C-1) semiautomatic pistol.)

(4) Whenever you clear a semiautomatic weapon the ammunition AND magazine should always be fully separated, the one from the other!

(5) Then - and, perhaps, thanks to God - Lee Paige had the (muddled) forethought to pull the trigger WHILE THE MUZZLE WAS NOT POINTED IN A SAFE DIRECTION!

I, personally, believe that Paige did this preparatory to handing his, 'big, bad, Glock Fo-tee' to the young boy sitting on the floor at his feet. (Those kids are never going to know how lucky they were that Paige's ricochet didn't get any of them AFTER he, literally, shot himself in the foot!)

So, there's the final two rules Paige broke: (1) He allowed the muzzle to point at something he was unwilling to see destroyed; (In this case, himself) and (2) he pulled the trigger BEFORE he'd made a conscious decision to fire. (Yes, he did! Pulling the trigger should NEVER BE a forethought; and in this case it was.) Paige could, very easily, have struck one of those children with the same bullet - or, conceivably, another one of his bullets - too.)

The whole event was a Keystone Cops' fire drill of normally irrevocable firearm-handling safety regulations - ALL rules that should never be broken! If there is any redemptive value to what happened in that Miami auditorium it is the warnings and precautions it presents. Everybody should learn from it, and never allow anything like this to ever happen again.

Last edited by Arc Angel; 02-23-2013 at 05:34..
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