[cowboywannabe]

Originally Posted by samurairabbi

Elegantly phrased!

bro, you can say that again!

i can get by on four handgun calibers, 9mm, 38spl, 32acp, and .22lr and meet all my family's handgunning needs.

the 45acp, 44spl, .357mag, 10mm, and the like are wants....

like long guns, a .22lr rifle and 30-06, coupled with a 12ga. would settle most any needs save for riot defense from the trogs the government lets roam around.

[SCmasterblaster]

I like my two M1911A1 .45s, but My G17 is always out and about with me. 17 rounds of +p+ 115gr 9mm JHPs will handle all threats just fine.

[MinervaDoe]

Lots of good comments. IMHO, My summary of some of the important points:

1. Both cartridges will blow great big holes in things.
2. With standard self defense loads, it is probably easier to reacquire the target for follow on shots with the .45 ACP.
3. If you don't reload, you are probably going to have much better luck acquiring ammunition over the counter for .45 ACP.
4. Both cartridges are very accurate.

[countrygun]

Originally Posted by MinervaDoe

Lots of good comments. IMHO, My summary of some of the important points:

1. Both cartridges will blow great big holes in things.
2. With standard self defense loads, it is probably easier to reacquire the target for follow on shots with the .45 ACP.
3. If you don't reload, you are probably going to have much better luck acquiring ammunition over the counter for .45 ACP.
4. Both cartridges are very accurate.

Good grief, 4 pages of debate and some smart*** has to come along and say it all in one post.

What is this world coming to?

[MinervaDoe]

Originally Posted by countrygun

Good grief, 4 pages of debate and some smart*** has to come along and say it all in one post.

Oh no, there were four pages chock full of 'mine's bigger' and 'sectional density is more important than velocity.'
You really have to savor that to appreciate the fervor with which some people hold their paradigms.

Originally Posted by countrygun

What is this world coming to?

Interesting question. Are we talking geologically, economically, or socially?

We could discuss the attributes of The Lost Generation, The Greatest Generation, The Silent Generation, The Baby Boomers, Generation X , Generation Y, and Generation Z

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...of_generations

Personally, I'd rather shoot holes through wet phone books.

[tenforme]

FWIW, after a lot of thought and research I picked up a G20 recently. My rationale was its versatility. I can load it up with Rem UJM's and shoot targets all day long for pretty much the same price as anything else (22LR aside).

For home protection I can load up with a variety of options that will drop a biped but not endanger my neighbors.

Its light enough for wilderness trekking and with full power loads will stop anything that I am likely to encounter.

And if I have the inclination or need, it is an effective hunting weapon, especially with a 6" barrel.

So far I have put 300 rounds through it (mostly Remington UMC 180 grain FMJ's at ~530ftlbf). While not full power they are a step up from equivalent .40 S&W and a big step up from the 9mm I am used to.

After reading all the stuff about the 10mm having a big kick, I was amazed and pleased by how little recoil the G20 has and how quickly I can get back on target. With UMC's I really don't see any difference between my G20 and a G34 I have used, in putting lots of rounds into the same hole quickly. I haven't had the opportunity to shoot full power rounds yet so am looking forward to that.

[MinervaDoe]

Originally Posted by tenforme

So far I have put 300 rounds through it (mostly Remington UMC 180 grain FMJ's at ~530ftlbf). While not full power they are a step up from equivalent .40 S&W and a big step up from the 9mm I am used to.

After reading all the stuff about the 10mm having a big kick, I was amazed and pleased by how little recoil the G20 has and how quickly I can get back on target. With UMC's I really don't see any difference between my G20 and a G34 I have used, in putting lots of rounds into the same hole quickly. I haven't had the opportunity to shoot full power rounds yet so am looking forward to that.

I found the same with American Eagle 10mm loads. They were a bit warmer than my own reloads, which hover around .40 S&W velocity. But with the large Glock frame, follow on shots are smooth at those velocities.

[countrygun]

Originally Posted by MinervaDoe

Oh no, there were four pages chock full of 'mine's bigger' and 'sectional density is more important than velocity.'
You really have to savor that to appreciate the fervor with which some people hold their paradigms.

I don't want to hear about what someone does with their paradigm. Some things should remain private



Interesting question. Are we talking geologically, economically, or socially?

I was referring to philosophically Existentially, the other measurements are valueless.

We could discuss the attributes of The Lost Generation, The Greatest Generation, The Silent Generation, The Baby Boomers, Generation X , Generation Y, and Generation Z

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...of_generations

Personally, I'd rather shoot holes through wet phone books.

But a hole is the absence of something, and if, existentially, the phonebook didn't exist, how can you measure something by the absence of something that didn't exist in the first place?

[MinervaDoe]

If you shoot well enough, they all go through the same hole anyhow.

Originally Posted by Sierra Bullets

The 10mm is an inherently accurate cartridge, routinely giving ten shot groups of under one inch here in the Sierra test range.

Originally Posted by Sierra Bullets

We have found the .40 S&W to be an accurate cartridge, but not quite capable of producing the incredible groups so frequently seen in the 10mm auto.

[SCmasterblaster]

Originally Posted by MinervaDoe

If you shoot well enough, they all go through the same hole anyhow.

I wonder how often this happens? More than one bullet in a wound track?

[tenforme]

Originally Posted by SCmasterblaster

I wonder how often this happens? More than one bullet in a wound track?

I think the original comment was wrt target shooting and 10mm accuracy.

[MinervaDoe]

Originally Posted by tenforme

I think the original comment was wrt target shooting and 10mm accuracy.

Yeah, I only shoot tin cans and paper.

[PghJim]

Originally Posted by SCmasterblaster

I wonder how often this happens? More than one bullet in a wound track?

One of my Kimber 1911's in 10mm regularly shoots one ragged hole less than an inch from a Ransom Rest at 25 yards. I have done the same things with a couple 45 acp 1911's. But the 45's were with target rounds. The 10mm is with full SD loads. As to which is more effective, I think that would come down to round selection and your beliefs. If you think faster, lighter bullets are more effective than the 10mm is your caliber. If slow and heavy is your cup of tea, then go with the 45.

[CDW4ME]

My 29 SF averages 1,279 fps / 562# KE with the Hornady 155 XTP.
If you want top KE: 10mm, larger diameter: 45.

[rustytxrx]

as much as I like the 10 mm, I like the G20 more. Now that I got a red dot sight on a new slide, it makes a lot of difference for my 70 year old visual acuity.

As far as someone thinking they have made a better choice of pistol and/or caliber....I hope you think your pistol/caliber choice is best you can get.

[dougader]

what red dot did you get, Rusty? My old eyes are requiring new optics for me as well. I wonder if there is a red dot sight that will fit in the stock dovetail that comes on the G20/G21

[rustytxrx]

Doug, I had local pistol smith put a C-More on it. I know he used one of these

http://www.natchezss.com/product.cfm...dID=CPSTSMT110

I also had him drill and tap a Judge for hunting smaller pigs. I works great.

[dougader]

nice. thanks!

[purrrfect 10]

Originally Posted by LASTRESORT20

`If you have to even ask....get yourself the 45....you dont deserve a 10mm.....


10mm is KING.

+1 I agree The 10mm can not be beaten by any 45 because there are choices of rounds for the ten that make it superior to any 45.

Do your research, if you what the best there is and choices of what you can shoot by simply changing your barrel or a full power 10mm. The BS about finding ammo is just that and the kick? there must be some real sissy's out the my wife is a little thing5'1' and she love shooting my g 20 she has an Lcp 380 and she wants a G29 10mm

Can not be beaten

[ithaca_deerslayer]

I was seriously considering a 10mm. I have a .44 mag revolver and figured the 10 would be a nice powerhouse semi-auto. I've got a 1911 .45, but never thought of that as being especially powerfull.

The Cuomo law in NYS has put an end to to my 10mm dream based on mag capacity. I going to get a Glock if in 10mm.

Now that next handgun purchase is between a carry .357 mag revolver (either a 3" steel j or an SP101) and a carry .45 Glock 36.

Until this thread I didn't realize so many people thought the .45 ACP an equal to the 10mm

My consideration for this type of gun are about a good concealed carry gun for self-defense in the city, but is also the ultimate bigfoot stopper in the woods. Sort of a town and country gun



___________
I joined the NRA, have you yet?

[SCmasterblaster]

Originally Posted by ithaca_deerslayer

I was seriously considering a 10mm. I have a .44 mag revolver and figured the 10 would be a nice powerhouse semi-auto. I've got a 1911 .45, but never thought of that as being especially powerfull.

The Cuomo law in NYS has put an end to to my 10mm dream based on mag capacity. I going to get a Glock if in 10mm.

Now that next handgun purchase is between a carry .357 mag revolver (either a 3" steel j or an SP101) and a carry .45 Glock 36.

Until this thread I didn't realize so many people thought the .45 ACP an equal to the 10mm

My consideration for this type of gun are about a good concealed carry gun for self-defense in the city, but is also the ultimate bigfoot stopper in the woods. Sort of a town and country gun



___________
I joined the NRA, have you yet?

I don't know which state is worse for gun owners - NY or CA.

[rustytxrx]

ith_ds, for civilian defensive carry, 45 vs 10 mm is a non-debate. Either caliber is as good as it gets given that you selected ammo that is capable. I often carry a 4" 45 acp or a compact 10 mm glock.

Either adequate in that roll. Where they separate is hunting situations. One in seven pistols wounds is lethal. You want better than that when hunting.

[KenMac]

Which ever you shoot best, assuming good ammo in each.

[SCmasterblaster]

Originally Posted by KenMac

Which ever you shoot best, assuming good ammo in each.

That's right - they are both excellent calibers.