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Old 02-19-2013, 09:15   #121
Southswede
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Originally Posted by FiremanMike View Post
Don't twist my words..

Right now it's not about equality, it's about survival. American gun owners are getting ****ed, but good guys still need to get access to guns. If we can leave these guns in the hands of the cops while we're fighting this crap, then at least some good guys out there are still ready to protect us against the bad guys who are definitely not giving up their arms.
I pinned on my first badge in 1982.

I started my career carrying a six shot revolver on duty and a five shot revolver off duty. I never felt under-gunned. I just did the job of going into harms way.

I fail to see why I should have access to a round count that the general public looses access to.
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Old 02-19-2013, 09:18   #122
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You can write all of those responses in one post you know
Just never you mind mister!!

I tried that before. I loos track of the various posts. (What can I say? I'm getting old!)
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Old 02-19-2013, 09:18   #123
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There's a whole lotta truth in this post. The anger should be directed toward the right people.


Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire
Agreed.
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Old 02-19-2013, 09:18   #124
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This is a train wreck; I'm out. Oh, and IBTL.
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Old 02-19-2013, 09:26   #125
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FOP. National lodge for starters.....
FOP is really not a police union.. It is a fraternal order that is supposed to represent all Officers , it does neither very well.

Local FOP's are where it is at National lost touch decades ago.
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Old 02-19-2013, 09:26   #126
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I've been taught that the military is the military and the rest are civilians. One is governed by the UCOMJ and the other by civilian laws and protected by those rights (civilians). Police Officers are civilian law enforcement, in other words civilians who enforce the law. I think the slang is to refer to the public as civilians, much as other groups do.
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/civilian

Definition of CIVILIAN

1: a specialist in Roman or modern civil law

2a: one not on active duty in the armed services or not on a police or firefighting force

b: outsider
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I've said it before and I'll say it here: they'd look better with lividity.
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Old 02-19-2013, 09:32   #127
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Just because the dictionary says police aren't civilians, it doesn't make it so. The police are US citizens working on US soil enforcing US law. They are not combatants that can be deployed to foreign nations as military members are. The police fall under the same laws as those they enforce while the military has additional laws and regulations governing them.
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Old 02-19-2013, 09:33   #128
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I have no problem with LaRue doing this. It's a business decision and if you disagree, you are free to take your business elsewhere. They will gain more business in the long term than from any LEOs who shop at a different site. It's also a political statement and one I happen to agree with.

The politicians are the enemy, not the manufacturer or business owner taking a stand. Does anyone honestly think that because one or two companies aren't selling to NYS, it'll adversely affect any LEO?? Even if Glock and S&W started doing the same thing, LE would survive. Are we being used as pawns? Absolutely, but I fault the politicians and not the companies. Just look at the hypocrisy coming from the politicians about guns. Heck, look at the economic information (a $85B cut in the increase in spending is a cut? On what planet is that a cut?)

If you truly believe that these companies are adversely affecting LE in NY, then boycott them. If you think they are making a statement because you and I can't, then support them.
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Old 02-19-2013, 09:36   #129
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Originally Posted by jay1975 View Post
Just because the dictionary says police aren't civilians, it doesn't make it so. The police are US citizens working on US soil enforcing US law. They are not combatants that can be deployed to foreign nations as military members are. The police fall under the same laws as those they enforce while the military has additional laws and regulations governing them.
Just because it's in the dictionary doesn't make it so... okay... let's make up our own definitions for stuff... you practicing to be a Democrat politician?

The view that it's military or else is a very narrow view of the word civilian which has nothing to do with the word other than the popular application.

The laws you live under doesn't matter when you think about it. Military members who are active but who are walking or driving around the city are still subject to civilian laws too.

Extending that even further, foreigners who are here are subject to American law, doesn't make them Americans. (although a lot of Democrats who need voters would think so)
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I've said it before and I'll say it here: they'd look better with lividity.
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Old 02-19-2013, 09:37   #130
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Mayhem, did NY write a law to ban certain types of cars or restrict the amount of gas each one can hold while exempting the police?
After Sandy, first responders were given preferential access to fuel.
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Old 02-19-2013, 09:46   #131
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After Sandy, first responders were given preferential access to fuel.
And every hurricane response including Andrew I have been involved with (while leaving my family at home to deal while I was working)..
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Old 02-19-2013, 09:47   #132
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lawman800, law enforcement are civilians. When you can get deployed to some third world crap hole as a combatant who is subject to the Geneva Conventions, then I would believe otherwise. Until then, you are a civi who enforces civi law on US soil. There is a fundamental difference between the mission of law enforcement and the mission of the military. One is to keep the peace and serve the criminal justice system of the US, the other is to meet on the field of battle, engage with and kill the enemies of the nation. It is an honorable and admirable position to be in law enforcement, but it is still a civi position.
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Old 02-19-2013, 09:49   #133
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lawman800, law enforcement are civilians. When you can get deployed to some third world crap hole as a combatant who is subject to the Geneva Conventions, then I would believe otherwise. Until then, you are a civi who enforces civi law on US soil. There is a fundamental difference between the mission of law enforcement and the mission of the military. One is to keep the peace and serve the criminal justice system of the US, the other is to meet on the field of battle, engage with and kill the enemies of the nation. It is an honorable and admirable position to be in law enforcement, but it is still a civi position.
You use the term civi like it is a pejorative.
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Old 02-19-2013, 09:51   #134
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IBTL for me too.

Another reason I'm glad to be in KY. Sure, we have the same bunch of libtard legislators propose sweeping gun- control legislation every year. It's always ignored and pro- gun legislation is passed instead. No gun manufacturer is going to see a political advantage to refusing Kentucky accounts.
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Old 02-19-2013, 09:53   #135
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You use the term civi like it is a pejorative.
Not at all, it's just the slang that we use. Civi police, civi clothes, civi laws etc. It is how we differentiate between military and civilian. Nearly everything is implied to be related to the military when on post, so to distinguish from that which is not, we add "civi" to whatever term we are using. It's an old habit and not meant to be disrespectful.
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Old 02-19-2013, 09:57   #136
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Just because the dictionary says police aren't civilians, it doesn't make it so.


Good grief. I can't believe we're having another retarded argument over the definition of "civilian." Words mean things. The dictionary defines what words mean, based in part, possibly primarily, upon common usage of the word.

Hey mods, can we make this kind of idiocy an explicit Coptalk no- no and post it in the sticky?
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Old 02-19-2013, 10:00   #137
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Hey mods, can we make this kind of idiocy an explicit Coptalk no- no and post it in the sticky?
Idiocy? Sorry pal, cops are civilians, regardless of how many sets of camouflage uniforms you may own.
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Old 02-19-2013, 10:04   #138
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Originally Posted by Mayhem like Me View Post
FOP is really not a police union.. It is a fraternal order that is supposed to represent all Officers , it does neither very well.

Local FOP's are where it is at National lost touch decades ago.
Fro starters, the FOP and the District of Columbia would agree with me and disagree with you. The FOP calls itself a "trade union". But what do they know, right?

Last edited by Southswede; 02-19-2013 at 10:05..
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Old 02-19-2013, 10:07   #139
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I think we are confusing the term citizen and civillians. We are citizens first and cops second. Cops aren't civilians (well some act like it but that is a subject for another thread).
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Old 02-19-2013, 10:07   #140
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Threads like this make the liberal gun grabbers proud...........
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