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Old 02-04-2013, 09:11   #1
NMG26
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44 lswc

I am getting ready to make an order from MBC. I am wondering what the aplication difference is between these two bullets. There is a 6 Brinell diffenerence. I will be loading mellow loads for a 2.625" Magnum.



.44 Elmer K
.430 Diameter
.44 Magnum
240 Grain SWC
Brinell 18
Keith-style, but with bevel-base
for reloading ease
Price per box of 500
Price: $49.00




Cowboy #3
.430 Diameter
Modern .44-40 and .44 Special
240 Grain TCFP
Brinell 12
For Cowboy Action Velocities
Price per box of 500
Price: $49.00
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Old 02-04-2013, 09:31   #2
Zombie Steve
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First one would be great for full power revolver loads / hunting applications. Second would be good for slower velocities, and the truncated cone will feed better in lever actions.

I shoot a Keith-ish bevel base semi wadcutter in revolver and lever action, but the front driving band can / does occasionally hang up in feeding. Mine wind up around 16-18 brinell, as I water drop straight clip on wheel weights. You can certainly shoot them slower. The semi-wadcutter design is one of my favorites. Accurate, cuts perfect holes and generally puts a good amount of thump on whatever it hits. I do full power, a rifle load (sort of in-beween... what my rifle likes) and a reduced load (around 950 fps from a 4" barrel) with mine, and no problems.

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Old 02-04-2013, 09:43   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zombie Steve View Post
First one would be great for full power revolver loads / hunting applications. Second would be good for slower velocities, and the truncated cone will feed better in lever actions.

I shoot a Keith-ish bevel base semi wadcutter in revolver and lever action, but the front driving band can / does occasionally hang up in feeding. Mine wind up around 16-18 brinell, as I water drop straight clip on wheel weights. You can certainly shoot them slower. The semi-wadcutter design is one of my favorites. Accurate, cuts perfect holes and generally puts a good amount of thump on whatever it hits. I do full power, a rifle load (sort of in-beween... what my rifle likes) and a reduced load (around 950 fps from a 4" barrel) with mine, and no problems.

Don't own a lever action yet. It is on my list of things to get.

I have been shooting a 357 LSWC Brinell 18 from my Sp101 3" with great results. I just realized I could have bought the same bullet with Brinell 12. I'm on my second box of 500.
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Old 02-04-2013, 10:04   #4
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The K is a SWC design, the other is a design for better feeding in light Cowboy loads. Either will work, just be aware they will NOT load the same as the TC has a much longer bearing surface & more of the bullet is inside the case. If you have NOT slugged your bore, I would go for a 0.431" bullet if available. A bullet slightly larger is better than one slightly smaller. Several of my S&W have cyl throats larger than 0.430", so a slightly bigger bullet will give better results. At vel under 1200fps, either bullet works if the fit is right.
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Old 02-04-2013, 10:17   #5
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I have the 300 grain tc bullets that i shoot in my 44 ruger. They are 18bhn and haven't leaded on me pushed up to 1400 fps. I also run the 255 grain 45 cal swc also at 18bhn in my 1911. I've run those to 1200 and have a clean bore and they feed very well. I also use the 357 bullets in 158 and 180s with heavy loads of both 2400, lil gun and 300mp powder and all have worked well. If you are running full pressure loads id go with the harder bullet plus the swc has a wider metplat and will hit harder if you use the gun for protection from big nasties. MBC has a good product. Be prepared to pi** of your mail man/lady. The box I had was 60 lbs and our mail lady isn't in the best shape. I think carrying the box to the door almost gave her a heart attack...
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Old 02-04-2013, 15:45   #6
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I cast my own KSWC 240 & 250 gn about 17 or 18 BNH A load them lighter for my Bulldog and heavier for the Ruger flattop. and shoot both out of my Winchester Trapper and haven't had a problem. IMHO you can load the KSWC to do what the other bullet does but loading the other up won't get you much.

You are a bit better off to worry matching the diameter than the BNH of the bullets,
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:41   #7
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So I ordered this one:

.44 Elmer K
.430 Diameter
.44 Magnum
240 Grain SWC
Brinell 18
Keith-style, but with bevel-base
for reloading ease

I have Unique powder. And I am using brand new magnum cases.

From the Alliant site.
Magnum:
240 gr cast LSWC 7 grains for a 7.5" barrel.
Special
240 gr Speer LSWC 6.3 grains for a 5.5" Barrel.

I am trying to hit something just above a 44 Special load.

My barrel is 2.625"........I am thinking I should start at 6.3 grain tops.

I don't have a chronograph.

Anyone crono'd .44 from a short barrel using Unique?
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:59   #8
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Again, rethink the 0.430" bullets & get 0.431" if available. FOr 900fps in a short 44mag, 8gr under a 245gr LSWC would be close, what I shoot in my 3" M629 for plinking.
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Old 02-05-2013, 11:39   #9
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Mine come through the sizer right at .430"... no issues with leading in the 4" 629 or 4-5/8" super blackhawk. Might work for your gun, might not. 18 brinell is plenty hard for what you're trying to do.

Depending on what alloy I'm getting, the bullets will weigh between 238 and 242 grains. On the lighter bullets, I'll load 8 grains of Unique. 7.8 grains for the heavier bullets. Both average 930 - 940 fps from my 4" barrel 629 and are very accurate.

My guess is you'll probably fall just under 900 fps with the short barrel, but there are differences in revolvers' barrels and cylinder gaps that will play with results and if your bullet. FWIW, I just looked up MBC's website. I'm shooting an almost identical bullet. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if they are using a Magma mold too.
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Old 02-05-2013, 16:08   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fredj338 View Post
Again, rethink the 0.430" bullets & get 0.431" if available. FOr 900fps in a short 44mag, 8gr under a 245gr LSWC would be close, what I shoot in my 3" M629 for plinking.

Great. I will shoot this lot and see how it goes.
There is a .431 available. About 30 bucks more from a different company. Laser-Cast 44 Cal. 240g SWG .431 77.50$ for 500. That is a 30 dollare price difference. Might be worth it. Will see.
http://www.laser-cast.com/44Cal.html

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zombie Steve View Post
Mine come through the sizer right at .430"... no issues with leading in the 4" 629 or 4-5/8" super blackhawk. Might work for your gun, might not. 18 brinell is plenty hard for what you're trying to do.

Depending on what alloy I'm getting, the bullets will weigh between 238 and 242 grains. On the lighter bullets, I'll load 8 grains of Unique. 7.8 grains for the heavier bullets. Both average 930 - 940 fps from my 4" barrel 629 and are very accurate.

My guess is you'll probably fall just under 900 fps with the short barrel, but there are differences in revolvers' barrels and cylinder gaps that will play with results and if your bullet. FWIW, I just looked up MBC's website. I'm shooting an almost identical bullet. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if they are using a Magma mold too.
Thanks.


.
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Old 02-07-2013, 17:04   #11
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+1 on 8.0gr Unique

I've shot 8.0 gr Unique in this caliber and it is extremely accurate with a mild report and minimal recoil. Mine are around 950fps and no leading. This load is also listed in the Hornady #4 manual.
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Old 02-23-2013, 09:42   #12
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So I went to the Bicycle shop where I normally buy my powder and they where out of Unique. Being new to reloading I did not know what to buy. I thought I had remembered something about Bullseye so I picked up a pound of that. I was glad to see that it was listed in Alliant's data for 44 magnum.

Seems like it is a faster burn.......not sure how that will effect things.

I used the last of my Unique on 50 rounds of 38 special last night.

.
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Old 02-23-2013, 09:55   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NMG26 View Post
So I went to the Bicycle shop where I normally buy my powder and they where out of Unique. Being new to reloading I did not know what to buy. I thought I had remembered something about Bullseye so I picked up a pound of that. I was glad to see that it was listed in Alliant's data for 44 magnum.

Seems like it is a faster burn.......not sure how that will effect things.

I used the last of my Unique on 50 rounds of 38 special last night.

.
BE is quite a bit faster/higher pressre & only suitable for low vel loads in the 44mag. You will NOT be able to see a max charge very well inside the large case, so be extremely cautious of a double charge. I would not recommend it but you already bought it.
FWIW, if you want to go 0.431" for what Lazer casts sells for, try theses guys. HE is cheaper & offers a wide selection. http://www.montanabulletworks.com/44_Mag_U99O.html
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Old 02-24-2013, 18:08   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fredj338 View Post
BE is quite a bit faster/higher pressre & only suitable for low vel loads in the 44mag. You will NOT be able to see a max charge very well inside the large case, so be extremely cautious of a double charge. I would not recommend it but you already bought it.
l
Yup, it worked nicely.

I shot 50 rounds today with 6 grains Bullseye. Not quite the punch that 7 grains of Unique, but a nice mild, accurate shooter.

I really like shooting the 44. I took 3 guns today and shot 50 rounds in each. I was switching back and forth between a Smith 638 .38 Special, Sp101 3" 357, and the Smith 629 2.625" bbl.

I shot better with the 629 then the other two.

Now I have three guns to clean.




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