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Old 01-16-2013, 18:14   #41
BLACK Z
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SO how and when are we going to find out what all the facts of this new law?

I can't believe this is happening what bs I truly hope this gets overturned at some point.

All this does is harm the average citizen, I can't believe they think true criminals are going to care about this law, there not sitting around stressing it.
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Old 01-16-2013, 18:15   #42
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Why should retired LEO be more privileged than a citizen with a carry permit?


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Old 01-16-2013, 18:55   #43
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Im not a leo, but can congress prohibit states from banning guns, mags, ammo and other gun accessories not prohibited by federal law?
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Old 01-16-2013, 19:21   #44
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Originally Posted by railfancwb View Post
Why should retired LEO be more privileged than a citizen with a carry permit?


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Take it up with President Bush, he signed it.
Quit hatin'.


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Old 01-16-2013, 19:30   #45
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Originally Posted by BLACK Z View Post
SO how and when are we going to find out what all the facts of this new law?

I can't believe this is happening what bs I truly hope this gets overturned at some point.

All this does is harm the average citizen, I can't believe they think true criminals are going to care about this law, there not sitting around stressing it.
Right on Z. That's why this is so painful and frustrating; watch Assemblyman McLaughlin articulate so many of the issues w.the bill here http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=lmPCRJJFlKA . He nails so many salient points, to which there's no reasonable, justifiable response and those given in the vid are laughable.

This was quite literally a blitzkrieg and there's a lot still to be worked out, such as how the hell they're going to enforce much of the new laws; there's no plan for a lot of it.

You want the facts?! Here's the bill in it's entirety. I printed it out so as not to go monitor-blind.
http://open.nysenate.gov/legislation/bill/S2230-2013
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Old 01-16-2013, 19:30   #46
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That doesn't help you when you are sitting in the county jail with a $50,000 bail because some country prosecutor has decided you need to be made an example of. You may win in the end, but at what cost. I have read the state AG will address the LEOSA HP issue in NJ at some point.
In the mean time, use Critical Defense ammo, that what the NJSP tells it retiring troopers to use.
The AG can address it all he wants. It doesnt matter.

It will have the same impact as states who have a law stating they will not enforce a federal AWB law. State, county and local LE dont enforce federal laws on their own anyway. Its all political posturing. I bet if the feds were denied assistance in enforcing these laws and they decided to hold up all federal funding for that state until they did, things would be different.

Mississippi, my state, is now drafting legislation enforcing the 2A. It is still only political grandstanding.



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Old 01-16-2013, 19:52   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BLACK Z View Post
SO how and when are we going to find out what all the facts of this new law?

I can't believe this is happening what bs I truly hope this gets overturned at some point.

All this does is harm the average citizen, I can't believe they think true criminals are going to care about this law, there not sitting around stressing it.

I am a (lowly) NRA instructor. People have been calling, emailing and texting me in a very steady stream since this morning - those who don't follow this stuff closely, asking me HOW COULD THIS HAPPEN??? I tell them they have to really keep their eyes on those ****ers in Albany. All it takes here is 3 men in a room to make a law (governor, speaker and president of the senate). It has mostly always been that way.


I ask you this:

The young man who is bent out of reality...he has a gun, let us say it is a Glock, and it is loaded with seven rounds, plus one in the chamber.

That 1st trigger pull, for that 1st round...do you think he is going to fire 6 or 7 rounds into the ground first to see if he can really do it, or do those crazy people start shooting to kill on round 1?

So those idiots banning standard capacity magazines...the dude who is intent on killing as many people as possible...does a 10 rd mag downloaded to 7 make a difference when everyone else is disarmed in a "gun free zone"? Is he stopping at round # 8 to go to a new magazine? Does it matter if the ban puts the round count at 3?

When guns are completely banned, and those crazy people decide to use a padlock to lock people in a room, doused with gasoline and torch em...then what?

I know, rhetorical question(s).
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Old 01-16-2013, 20:50   #48
ithaca_deerslayer
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When guns are completely banned, and those crazy people decide to use a padlock to lock people in a room, doused with gasoline and torch em...then what?
Don't be silly, fortunately the politicians have thought ahead on this one.

As you know, because of a previous state law a couple years ago, the gasoline can only be poured from a ventless container.

That means the gas will at first pour out a few ounces, then gurgle to a stop, then the container will struggle for a few moments to fill back up with air Thus giving the victims lots of time to figure out an escape.

And as the bad guy attempts to tip the container back up to move to another position, the ventless nozzle will undoubtedly stick open and spill all over his leg, while unleashing 10x more fumes into the atmosphere than the old outlawed vented containers ever did.

By time the bad guy is ready to light the fire, he'll be soaked in gas and hardly any gas will have made it to his objective.


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Old 01-16-2013, 21:02   #49
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Ok what is the verdict??? I am planning on being in NYC later this month and in February. I am/was planning on carrying my off-duty G27.........

I know NYPD is very friendly towards visiting out-of-state officers. How will they look at the 9-round magazine of my official off-duty/back-up weapon?
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Old 01-16-2013, 21:05   #50
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Don't be silly, fortunately the politicians have thought ahead on this one.

As you know, because of a previous state law a couple years ago, the gasoline can only be poured from a ventless container.

That means the gas will at first pour out a few ounces, then gurgle to a stop, then the container will struggle for a few moments to fill back up with air Thus giving the victims lots of time to figure out an escape.

And as the bad guy attempts to tip the container back up to move to another position, the ventless nozzle will undoubtedly stick open and spill all over his leg, while unleaching 10x more fumes into the atmosphere than the old outlawed vented containers ever did.

By time the bad guy is ready to light the fire, he'll be soaked in gas and hardly any gas will have made it to his objective.

I'm laughing because 1. that's a damn funny analogy, and 2. it's so true it forces a laugh of despair . Hell I take that stupid ass nozzle off and use a funnel instead. If I see an old school red can, with the flex nozzle that dips into the can, on the highway shoulder I will risk my car and life to pull over and grab it! Sad, I know.
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Old 01-16-2013, 21:08   #51
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Originally Posted by Panzergrenadier1979 View Post
Ok what is the verdict??? I am planning on being in NYC later this month and in February. I am/was planning on carrying my off-duty G27.........

I know NYPD is very friendly towards visiting out-of-state officers. How will they look at the 9-round magazine of my official off-duty/back-up weapon?
Honestly, nobody has even had time to digest and figure this nonsense out. Still, I don't see you a) getting made or having your weapon inspected; b) getting jammed up over that; and c) you're good with a 9rd mag as long as you knock off the top two and keep 'em in your pocket

To wit there's no exception for NY LE even, but I'm not worried about it. For whatever that's worth.


.

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Old 01-17-2013, 04:40   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Panzergrenadier1979 View Post
Ok what is the verdict??? I am planning on being in NYC later this month and in February. I am/was planning on carrying my off-duty G27.........

I know NYPD is very friendly towards visiting out-of-state officers. How will they look at the 9-round magazine of my official off-duty/back-up weapon?
I cannot speak with any authority , but my own interactions with NY LE says you will have LESS of an issue now that before this law was passed. I've heard one or 1/2 dozen of them say "screw this". But hey, you never know. A 9 rd mag will be fine. Unless you did something really outrageously silly (drunk + weapons discharge or weapons display) no one will give two ****s.


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...
To wit there's no exception for NY LE even, but I'm not worried about it. For whatever that's worth.


.
For clarification, Article 265 has NEVER applied to NYS law enforcement officers. That exemption is clearly and specifically articulated in the penal code, in multiple sections.
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Old 01-17-2013, 04:43   #53
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Now here is one stupid ramification of the law:

You flew into NY with your Glock 27 and a spare mag - great. On the way in from GA, TN, MI, FL nobody checks ****.

You see the sights, visit your aunts and cousins, everything is cool, you are covered under HR-218.

On the way out at the airport, you check your gun in. SOP is to have a Port Auth cop (LGA, JFK, EWR) or Westchester Co cop (HPN) verify your ability to POSSESS a handgun. If you have 9 rounds in a 9 round mag...that you are using for transport under FOPA, what the **** are they gonna do? Say the mags should have been downloaded to 7 rounds? Say you need to have the ammo in a cardboard box?

Utter stupidity.
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Old 01-17-2013, 05:37   #54
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After this I won't got into the state on principle alone. I'd wanting to visit NYC at some point but I will not use my money to support a state that will pass this crap.
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Old 01-17-2013, 06:34   #55
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Originally Posted by Gallium View Post
Now here is one stupid ramification of the law:

You flew into NY with your Glock 27 and a spare mag - great. On the way in from GA, TN, MI, FL nobody checks ****.

You see the sights, visit your aunts and cousins, everything is cool, you are covered under HR-218.

On the way out at the airport, you check your gun in. SOP is to have a Port Auth cop (LGA, JFK, EWR) or Westchester Co cop (HPN) verify your ability to POSSESS a handgun. If you have 9 rounds in a 9 round mag...that you are using for transport under FOPA, what the **** are they gonna do? Say the mags should have been downloaded to 7 rounds? Say you need to have the ammo in a cardboard box?

Utter stupidity.
Yep, ammo in the box or at least out of the mag. Mags need to be unloaded anyway before checking in - certainly hope anyone, much less LE, carrying knows better than to start clearing their weapon and unloading mags standing at the counter , so # rounds shouldn't be an issue regardless. Still, I concur, I don't see LE getting jammed up over something like this.

I've traveled from HPN and LGA many times w.my BUG and I think only once has PA looked in the case even. Highly doubt any of them are counting rounds even if you arrive w.a loaded mag.

.

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Old 01-17-2013, 08:04   #56
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Yep, ammo in the box or at least out of the mag. Mags need to be unloaded anyway before checking in - certainly hope anyone, much less LE, carrying knows better than to start clearing their weapon and unloading mags standing at the counter , so # rounds shouldn't be an issue regardless. Still, I concur, I don't see LE getting jammed up over something like this.

I've traveled from HPN and LGA many times w.my BUG and I think only once has PA looked in the case even. Highly doubt any of them are counting rounds even if you arrive w.a loaded mag.

.

I fly with ammo in mags all the time (ok, for clarity, 1-2x a month). I don't keep the gun and the ammo together, since Delta(?) IIRC requires TWO checked bags if you are flying with guns (one for gun, one for ammo). (it is either delta or some other airline).

My gun is locked with a cable lock thru the open action upon check in, or field stripped in the case.

I have a bud (WC Sgt) who was at HPN. About a week after the elections I got an email from him saying "**** it", he retired (he had the time) and is now somewhere out in PA. I called him after getting the email and he said "Drew, it is only gonna get worse, I have to leave on my terms".

I can't believe how prophetic his words are.
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Old 01-17-2013, 08:16   #57
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I figured at least LE would exempt form this crap.
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Old 01-17-2013, 08:17   #58
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Originally Posted by Gallium View Post
(Jibber Jabber)

I am not a cop or a peace officer.
Clearly.

Look up 18USC926B. The requirements set forth for a person to be considered a "qualified law enforcement officer" are what are covered in this thread, not who may or may not "techincally be a peace officer in New York.
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Old 01-17-2013, 08:44   #59
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The part that makes no sense to me is the 7 SHot mag limit, Most people have 10 Round mags, what a pain to go and get new mags and what not, most manufactures don't even make seven round mags and I doubt they will want to or be in a hurry to make them for one state. These rules are not going to stop the killing people that want to do this stuff are going to do it.

Try and keep the guns out of the wrong hands I am ok with some parts of the bill but some of it is just makes no sense.
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Old 01-17-2013, 08:54   #60
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Originally Posted by BLACK Z View Post
The part that makes no sense to me is the 7 SHot mag limit, Most people have 10 Round mags, what a pain to go and get new mags and what not, most manufactures don't even make seven round mags and I doubt they will want to or be in a hurry to make them for one state. These rules are not going to stop the killing people that want to do this stuff are going to do it.

Try and keep the guns out of the wrong hands I am ok with some parts of the bill but some of it is just makes no sense.
Lest you overlook, this bill is based on emotion rather than reason. There's very little meritorious in the bill. 7Round limits and mag cap is just asinine. Don't bother discarding your 10rd mags, just load with 7 if you're really concerned about this.


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