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Old 12-14-2012, 13:28   #226
LawScholar
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Originally Posted by certifiedfunds View Post
I gotcha.

I don't and have no interest in it.

If I could find the same user experience off the shelf from another company at a better price I'd buy it. I haven't seen it though.
That's fair. For an off-the-shelf experience, especially for the non-tech-inclined, Apple does great work,

Again, I'm typing this on an iPhone, because I want a simple, smooth-running phone and don't care about the Android advantages for customization.
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Old 12-14-2012, 14:06   #227
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Originally Posted by Durden View Post
I could build 3 very high end DESKTOP systems for what Mac charges.

I know because I built one, just 4 months ago. They don't make a Mac that can touch it.
Fixed your post for you. You are talking about desktops. We are talking about laptops.


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Old 12-14-2012, 15:11   #228
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Macs users remind me of the type of people who don't change their own oil (or don't even know that it needs to be changed..) They don't care how anything works, they don't care if the issues they are seeing are being caused by themselves, and they have some strange idea in their mind that PCs are unreliable -- very much like someone driving 150,000 miles without changing the oil, and then complaining that their car is unreliable.

One other thing that doesn't get touched on very much is that the amount of choice you have is extremely limited with Macs. Am I the only one who noticed that Macs are all the same color with the same bland, overly-minimalistic appearance? Where is the choice of being able to pick something that reflects your personality? I thought Apple was so wonderful and innovative -- yet, their computer cases are nothing more than a rounded rectangle that any design student could create in 5 minutes. Frankly, these simplistic designs we see from Apple time and time again are about as interesting as a room full of Japanese businessmen in their grey suits. How exciting, innovative and creative! Heck, you can't even get one in black.

Oh, and by the way, once more virus creators start targeting Apple you'll be seeing the same kind of problems you had with Windows (it's already happening, actually.) And that is because the problem lies with the users, not the OS. If you run a program that is meant to delete all your files on a Mac, it will delete all your files. Macs are not magical. The only issue right now is that 99.99999% of the malware/viruses floating around only run on Windows. Wait until they become more common on Macs. Take a look: http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/0...o-longer-safe/
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Old 12-14-2012, 16:06   #229
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^Truth

As macs continue to overtake more and more of the computer market they will one day be targeted on the same level that pc is now.

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Old 12-14-2012, 16:14   #230
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Originally Posted by Hawkeye16 View Post
Fixed your post for you. You are talking about desktops. We are talking about laptops.


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He was replying to my post, which was about the Mac Pro desktop system.
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Old 12-14-2012, 16:29   #231
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Originally Posted by arizona_andy View Post
Macs users remind me of the type of people who don't change their own oil (or don't even know that it needs to be changed..) They don't care how anything works, they don't care if the issues they are seeing are being caused by themselves, and they have some strange idea in their mind that PCs are unreliable -- very much like someone driving 150,000 miles without changing the oil, and then complaining that their car is unreliable.

One other thing that doesn't get touched on very much is that the amount of choice you have is extremely limited with Macs. Am I the only one who noticed that Macs are all the same color with the same bland, overly-minimalistic appearance? Where is the choice of being able to pick something that reflects your personality? I thought Apple was so wonderful and innovative -- yet, their computer cases are nothing more than a rounded rectangle that any design student could create in 5 minutes. Frankly, these simplistic designs we see from Apple time and time again are about as interesting as a room full of Japanese businessmen in their grey suits. How exciting, innovative and creative! Heck, you can't even get one in black.

Oh, and by the way, once more virus creators start targeting Apple you'll be seeing the same kind of problems you had with Windows (it's already happening, actually.) And that is because the problem lies with the users, not the OS. If you run a program that is meant to delete all your files on a Mac, it will delete all your files. Macs are not magical. The only issue right now is that 99.99999% of the malware/viruses floating around only run on Windows. Wait until they become more common on Macs. Take a look: http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/0...o-longer-safe/
You're just being whiny. Comparing milled aluminum unibody to the plethora of craptastic black plastic pc laptops and calling them bland is funny.

People can argue specs all they want but in terms of design there is no comparison.


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Old 12-14-2012, 16:52   #232
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I actually like the bland, plain, rectangle look of the macbook a lot. It is very simple and clean, and looks very nice.
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Old 12-14-2012, 17:15   #233
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Originally Posted by certifiedfunds View Post
You're just being whiny. Comparing milled aluminum unibody to the plethora of craptastic black plastic pc laptops and calling them bland is funny.

People can argue specs all they want but in terms of design there is no comparison.


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A number of PC makers make Mac-quality cases now. Check out the Dell XPS Ultrabooks & HP Envy Ultrabooks.

The Dell XPS Ultrabook is one I've used for about a week on loan from a friend. It's very, very nice, machined aluminum and carbon fiber. Starting at $1000.

Though my current laptop, about 2 1/2 years old, is an HP Pavilion dv6, and yeah, this thing is kinda junky. One of my hinges is loose and the body feels like a Mattel toy. To be fair to it, I expected it to fall apart within a month or two. I'm a VERY heavy user, my computer is on with diligent notes being taken for hours practically every day, and my typing strikes are pretty hard. But it has hung in there, knock on wood.

http://www.dell.com/content/topics/s...=us&l=en&cs=19

http://www.shopping.hp.com/en_US/hom...nvy-ultrabooks
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Old 12-14-2012, 17:25   #234
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Ive got a 15" MacBook Pro and a 13" Sony Vaio S. They are both amazing machines. I would not want to have to choose between one or the other and I dont see why so many people want to do that.
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Old 12-14-2012, 18:27   #235
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Why limit yourself to just vanilla ice cream?
I like all the flavors.
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Old 12-14-2012, 19:10   #236
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Originally Posted by NMGlocker View Post
The Okie Corral
Why limit yourself to just vanilla ice cream?
I like all the flavors.
L-R, Dell Ubuntu 10.10, Samsung Windows 8, Apple MBAir OSX
Exactly what I was saying a page back, both operating systems have their uses. How is windows 8 working out for you? I have heard some mixed reviews about it
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Old 12-14-2012, 19:36   #237
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Use What Works for You...

Ah the ol' Ford vs Chevy, Coke vs Pepsi, PC vs Mac religious wars. Gotta love 'em.

I say: use what works for you. And note that what works for you may not work for someone else.

Since we're all whipping it out...

I'm writing this on my 15" Retina Macbook Pro right now. It's probably my 4th or 5th MBP; I never get rid of the previous ones because they're "broken" or "useless". I get rid of them because I like the specs of the next one. That said, these Retina laptops are phenomenal! Specially the 2880x1800 resolution I'm currently running it at. Just unreal on a 15" screen. But, the potential downside of these specific models of MBPs: they're less end-user serviceable due to choices Apple made. The current generation of MBP that isn't Retina is still end-user serviceable

My previous MBP (now in my mom's hands) was immediately customized by me the second I got it. I ripped the back plate off and upgrade the RAM from 4G to 8, while removing the spinning disk and replacing it with an Intel SSD. Who says you can't work on 'em?

Up in my office, I have what I consider a juggernaut of a Mac Pro that has been highly customized by yours truly after purchasing it. In fact, I purchased it used knowing full well I intended to overhaul it: 2 new Xeon processors, 48G of RAM, PC-based nVidia video card flashed to work properly in a Mac, a Blu-Ray player to replace the OEM DVD-ROM, and an SSD in the second external 5.25" bay to boot from and store applications. That left the other 4 drive bays open for a bunch more drives. That machine is my video editing rig.

But sitting right next to it: my Windows 7 gaming rig. Brand new LGA2011 motherboard and chip, nVidia GTX680 Classified, 2 SSDs striped together for the C: drive, and 3 24" LCD panels connected to it for the full "surround" gaming experience.

In the closet in my office: another PC running VMWare ESXi, which has a bunch of various VMs on it including: a few Linux VMs, a Solaris VM, FreeBSD, and hell, even a Windows 2008 server VM.

Next to the VM server: a 4-bay QNAP NAS where I store all my stuff. Connected to it: a 4-bay RAID5 enclosure that serves as a directly-attached backup for the NAS.

In my living room: an HTPC made with components that are a couple of years old, running Windows 7. Why's it there? I digitize all of my DVDs and Blu-Rays, and use it to play them in the living room.

Next to that: my router. A small mini-ITX system with 3 GigE interfaces in it, running Linux off of a USB stick, and routing all of the traffic through my cable modem and around the house.

Lots to read, but the executive summary is: use what works for you.

(And yes, I change my own oil, and do a lot more than that, too).

jas
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Old 12-14-2012, 21:29   #238
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Exactly what I was saying a page back, both operating systems have their uses. How is windows 8 working out for you? I have heard some mixed reviews about it
Win8 took me about 10 minutes to familiarize myself with the start menu/metro interface and menu locations then another 5 minutes to set it up the way I like.
After that it's been fast and stable.
It's different but the same.

I use Win8 for Office and Windows native software. The business world standard is still Windows and will be for the foreseeable future.

I use Ubuntu as my home internet machine. Pretty much virus and malware proof and allows me to surf the seedy side of the net with impunity.

The MBAir is my traveling companion. There's really nothing like it in the ultrabook category. OSX is more secure than Windows, especially when utilizing open networks on the road. If I have any issues while on the road it's nice to have access to an Apple store for immediate repairs. A Lenovo X1 carbon running Ubuntu would make a good replacement, but the MBAir works great right out of the box.

People getting all wound up and married to a computer OS is amusing and sad at the same time.
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Old 12-15-2012, 05:03   #239
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LawScholar View Post
A number of PC makers make Mac-quality cases now. Check out the Dell XPS Ultrabooks & HP Envy Ultrabooks.

The Dell XPS Ultrabook is one I've used for about a week on loan from a friend. It's very, very nice, machined aluminum and carbon fiber. Starting at $1000.

Though my current laptop, about 2 1/2 years old, is an HP Pavilion dv6, and yeah, this thing is kinda junky. One of my hinges is loose and the body feels like a Mattel toy. To be fair to it, I expected it to fall apart within a month or two. I'm a VERY heavy user, my computer is on with diligent notes being taken for hours practically every day, and my typing strikes are pretty hard. But it has hung in there, knock on wood.

http://www.dell.com/content/topics/s...=us&l=en&cs=19

http://www.shopping.hp.com/en_US/hom...nvy-ultrabooks
So to my point to the guy complaining that the Mac notebook line was dull and lacking design features, in this respect they lead the market and the other makers are following.

My 2 personal machines are a MBP15 and a MBA11. Both dual booting Win7 via parallels.

I purchased the MBA to lighten my travel bag and improve usability over the crappy Dell Latitude my employer issues. It is a phenomenal machine and has become my primary. I take it with me everywhere.

Also in the house I have a 2006 MBP17 in need of a new HDD, a 13MBP, a 13MBA, 2006 MB.







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Old 12-15-2012, 05:05   #240
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Old 12-15-2012, 08:12   #241
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Best of Luck with your new lap top, My kids have macs since 2004 and they work perfect, I still have PC's as that's what we have at work. I don't want to switch as I don't want to unlearn what I all ready know about using a pc.

Once some one see how flawless a mac can be or how Great it is to walk into an apple store and have a situation resolved with in minutes with out having the frustration of a 45 minute wait for a customer support phone call with a person you don't understand.

The whole apple exspereance is worth more then what we pay for the products.
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Old 12-15-2012, 10:13   #242
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I have (3) MacBook's that just turned 4yrs old last month. One with severe abuse from my daughter but they all still work flawlessly. Not the fastest machines anymore but I only have to reboot them about once every few months. Yes you pay a premium but they work, keep working and not cluttered with crap. Bought a 21.5" iMac a few months ago and it's a screamer, probably wont need another computer for another 4 yrs now.

Honestly I don't understand why people think the Mac's are so overpriced? It wasn't all that long ago that a Dell or Gateway PC was $2500-$3500, so $1199 or so (especially in 2012 dollars) isn't really that much.
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Old 12-15-2012, 12:10   #243
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Macs users remind me of the type of people who don't change their own oil (or don't even know that it needs to be changed..) They don't care how anything works, they don't care if the issues they are seeing are being caused by themselves, and they have some strange idea in their mind that PCs are unreliable -- very much like someone driving 150,000 miles without changing the oil, and then complaining that their car is unreliable.
The depth of ignert.

I've been PC for more than 20 years and Mac for 2. I know everything I need to know about keeping a PC running. You sound about like a guy that would rather be spinning wrenches on his car than driving it, if you're into analogies.

I can spin those wrenches, I just can't be bothered. I have both platforms and am a programmer.

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One other thing that doesn't get touched on very much is that the amount of choice you have is extremely limited with Macs.
As opposed to being blinded with choices that are meaningless?

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Am I the only one who noticed that Macs are all the same color with the same bland, overly-minimalistic appearance?
I find them crisp, clean and sleek and much better than the plastic-ee junk that all the PC users put out. Like my VAIO from sony, will never buy Sony again. Mail order mediocrity I wish I'd seen before ordering.

the Macbook pros are CNC milled out of a billet of solid aluminum. They are hands down the best hardware I've ever owned.

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Where is the choice of being able to pick something that reflects your personality?
Oh I see. You want something in pink, like dell is putting out. Enjoy!

Who gives a rats about "style" WTF are you DOING with that thing anyway? It's what's on the inside that counts, it s a freaking computer, not a style statement.

You can put stickers on the outside of your case, whatever floats your boat.

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Oh, and by the way, once more virus creators start targeting Apple you'll be seeing the same kind of problems you had with Windows (it's already happening, actually.) And that is because the problem lies with the users, not the OS.
This statement has been around for decades. Still waiting.

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Heck, you can't even get one in black.
My sony VAIO is black. Havent turned it on several months. Your point again?

Let me guess…Apple is racist?
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Old 12-15-2012, 12:35   #244
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Simplicity is one of the main reasons I picked Mac.

I hate technology. I like to browse the web, and a computer is mandatory for my work, so a laptop in my life is a sort of necessity.

But its because I hate technology that I've abandoned PC. I don't want to look under the hood of my computer and learn about kernels and root directories: I just want it to work.
Just understand you're paying a hefty surcharge because you're a computer noob.
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Old 12-15-2012, 13:21   #245
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There are some very cool things about the Macbooks, such as the Mag-Safe charger and the aluminum case. But I need to run Windows 7 and dual monitor support each for two pieces of software I use, Cadence PCB Design Studio and Mentor Graphics Hyperlynx. Those two packages will put the hurt on many PCs, especially when running at the same time using four monitors, so I invested in a Dell Precision workstation laptop setup.

There are some nice things about it such that it shares the AC adapter plug with all of the Dell business laptops, the dual graphics cards, the nice docking station, and the two solid-state drives. The nicest thing is that I can upgrade it. The newish Macs have eliminated that as the drives are flash chips soldered to the motherboard as is the RAM. The downside of the Dell is that it is so freaking heavy at more than nine pounds. There is a tradeoff between flexibility and weight.

My daughter runs a Macbook Air and loves it. For goofing off I use a Chromebook. For meetings I take a Dell Latitude and remote desktop into my Precision unless I need to do PCB design. Then I take the big iron with me. I pick the tool for the job I need to do, not for the brand.
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Old 12-15-2012, 13:33   #246
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Merry Christmas!

Welcome to the much happier Mac world. After you are fully acclimated, you'll wonder why you took so long to do this--but you will savor the quality of your good decision from here forward.
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Old 12-15-2012, 14:02   #247
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I am typing this on a mid 2010 macbook pro that I upgraded recently to 8gb of ram and put in a 512 crucial SSD.

Seems to be working fine for me...
Yeah, same here, upgraded my 2009 Macbook Pro 500 HDD to an 256 SSD. I don't know of any Windows laptops that have upgrade-able video cards in them these days.

(I work in our company's helpdesk supporting Win-based computers and am so burnt out on Windows machines I will never buy another one.)

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Old 12-15-2012, 14:15   #248
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Originally Posted by dixietoo View Post

For me, the Mac-PC questions boils down to how mechanically minded the purchaser is.
The guy who changes his own oil or installs his own tile in the kitchen is a PC guy ....

I build my 1911s, it's a hobby that I enjoy. As I'm a professional mechanic I have no desire to 'work after work' unless it's a hobby. Hence I drive Toyota Tacomas and use Apple computers.

I have noted over the years that Mac users are happier than PC users.
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Old 12-15-2012, 14:38   #249
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Old 12-15-2012, 14:53   #250
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I have noted over the years that Mac users are happier than PC users.
Meh, I use both and my dad uses PCs only. We are both happy. Of course I built his PCs as well as mine using high-end components. I always maintain that mac users are only happy because they jumped from junky PCs to high-end and high priced macs, and you get what you pay for no matter what you decide to go with.
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