I think the NFA is Unconstitutional - Page 5

Ruggles · 12-09-2012, 11:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kingarthurhk

Well, for the good of society we should get rid of the 4th Amendment, it would be easier to catch criminals that way, and warrants would be uncessary. The 5th Amendment, that would allow prosecutions to go more smoothly, because you could be forced to incriminate yourself and court appointed attorneys would not be required. The 13th Amendment to keep idiots who don't own property and are on welfare from voting.

What a better society we could have, right?

What are you talking about? Because I draw a line in regard to a right I am in favor of removing that right or all rights? Honestly that is the debating thought process of a child.

Kingarthurhk · 12-09-2012, 11:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruggles

When you live in a society your rights (and the lines attached to them) are determined by that society not you. Hell that is why we have the Founding Documents we are debating in the first place, they are needed to form a society. You sound like you would prefer a society where there are no laws or limits and everybody decides for themselves. You might want to move

Well, in that case, society has become increasingly Atheist. They have determined that your antiquated and ignorant relgion is a deteriment to society and is now banned.

Ruggles · 12-09-2012, 11:30

I am going to the movie now so you guys have fun.

zoyter2 · 12-09-2012, 11:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kingarthurhk

I guess you could make the same argument for all firearms, and pointy objects. I guess we should ban everything? Imagine the fun at the range being able to lob grenades on a throw line? Heck, I remember going to an airshow when I was five where I got to fire a deactived mortor. That was an awesome experience.

Like the Bill of Rights has an expiration date because it is 2012?

I am making no argument. I am asking a question. But, without giving opinions, can I ask you if you are comparing the possession of a firearm, 'pointy object' with the possession of a explosive, fragmenting device?

If you really consider all three falling under the same catagory for comparison, please just move along and don't waste your time by explaining.

Ruggles · 12-09-2012, 11:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kingarthurhk

Well, in that case, society has become increasingly Atheist. They have determined that your antiquated and ignorant relgion is a deteriment to society and is now banned.

They have indeed in many ways, but that does not change my views on what we are debating.

Kingarthurhk · 12-09-2012, 11:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruggles

I am going to the movie now so you guys have fun.

Enjoy your prescribed First Amendment entertainment choice.

Ruggles · 12-09-2012, 11:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kingarthurhk

Enjoy your prescribed First Amendment entertainment choice.

I will, it's a kids movie so I know I won'y subjugate my 10 year old to a graphic sex scene at least. Thanks to the rating system, see society is not all bad.

Now I just hope the guy sitting in front of me does not drop his frag grenade when reaching for his Milk Duds

Kingarthurhk · 12-09-2012, 11:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruggles

I will, it's a kids movie so I know I won'y subjugate my 10 year old to a graphic sex scene at least. Thanks to the rating system, see society is not all bad.

Now I just hope the guy sitting in front of me does not drop his frag grenade when reaching for his Milk Duds

Okay, but be sure to leave the Glock at home. They don't allow those at sporting and entertainment venues.

BEER · 12-09-2012, 11:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott3670

Isn't the NFA based on the wishes of the people back in 1934? They were tired of all the gangster violence (drive-by shootings with Tommy guns and sawed-off shotguns, etc.) and wanted something done about it. If I've got this right (and I'm not saying that I do) then, with all due respect, why are we blaming the Government for something we wanted?

civilians weren't the ones pushing for firearms restrictions, law enforcement was. cops and federal agents were literally outgunned and tired of losing.

it was also another charge they could throw at the bad guys once they caught them.

Kingarthurhk · 12-09-2012, 11:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by zoyter2

I am making no argument. I am asking a question. But, without giving opinions, can I ask you if you are comparing the possession of a firearm, 'pointy object' with the possession of a explosive, fragmenting device?

If you really consider all three falling under the same catagory for comparison, please just move along and don't waste your time by explaining.

They all have a purpose destroying things and killing things. If you are going to pick and choose, you may as well throw the baby out with the bathwater.

Kingarthurhk · 12-09-2012, 11:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by BEER

civilians weren't the ones pushing for firearms restrictions, law enforcement was. cops and federal agents were literally outgunned and tired of losing.

it was also another charge they could throw at the bad guys once they caught them.

That has changed. I have carried SBR full autos, Shor barrled shotguns. So, I don't see that as a relevant argument.

Bruce M · 12-09-2012, 11:58

I am convinced. Even if virtually no court agrees with me. What do they know about Constitutional law anyway.

Kingarthurhk · 12-09-2012, 12:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bruce M

I am convinced. Even if virtually no court agrees with me. What do they know about Constitutional law anyway.

True, try having a garden and see how far you get. Or, if you make your own fish pond and have your property seized as a "wet land". Might always makes right, right?

Bruce M · 12-09-2012, 12:06

What - no one can have a garden anymore? No one has gardens anymore?

Kingarthurhk · 12-09-2012, 12:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bruce M

What - no one can have a garden anymore? No one has gardens anymore?

There is a long standing Supreme Court ruling on that. A farmer was growing crops on his own land and wasn't crossing interstate lines, and he was disallowed to grow or sell crops. This happened in the early part of the last century. It still stands that the government can order you not to grow crops on your own property.

Bruce M · 12-09-2012, 12:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kingarthurhk

There is a long standing Supreme Court ruling on that. A farmer was growing crops on his own land and wasn't crossing interstate lines, and he was disallowed to grow or sell crops. This happened in the early part of the last century. It still stands that the government can order you not to grow crops on your own property.

That sounds nearly as imminently threatening to all that is our way of life as quartering some returning middle east veterans.

Kingarthurhk · 12-09-2012, 12:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bruce M

That sounds nearly as imminently threatening to all that is our way of life as quartering some returning middle east veterans.

Like I said, the Constitution and the Bill of Rights will disappear not with a bang, but a whimper.

Ruggles · 12-09-2012, 12:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kingarthurhk

Okay, but be sure to leave the Glock at home. They don't allow those at sporting and entertainment venues.

How dare you! I am a 1911 guy, not a Glock guy!!

And I am indeed legally carrying said 1911 as I wait for the movie to start

Kingarthurhk · 12-09-2012, 12:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruggles

How dare you! I am a 1911 guy, not a Glock guy!!

And I am indeed legally carrying said 1911 as I wait for the movie to start

Interesting, unless it comes with badge and creds, I don't think they allow CCL in theaters and sporting events. That is why Colorado was such a target rich environment. I thought you were a law abiding person who believed in strict limits on the Second Amendment. You are not one of those guys who says, "Everyone else, but me," are you?

Ruble Noon · 12-09-2012, 13:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruggles

When you live in a society your rights (and the lines attached to them) are determined by that society not you. Hell that is why we have the Founding Documents we are debating in the first place, they are needed to form a society. You sound like you would prefer a society where there are no laws or limits and everybody decides for themselves. You might want to move

I might have to because statist's like you have destroyed freedom in this country.

holesinpaper · 12-09-2012, 15:01

The NFA is unconstitutional.

Was this question rhetorical?

muscogee · 12-09-2012, 15:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kingarthurhk

Interesting, unless it comes with badge and creds, I don't think they allow CCL in theaters and sporting events.

I'm not sure about that. I've never seen a 30-06 at a theater and I go quite a bit. All I have seen are the silly, "Unlicensed possession blah blah blah" signs.

Ruggles · 12-09-2012, 15:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kingarthurhk

Interesting, unless it comes with badge and creds, I don't think they allow CCL in theaters and sporting events. That is why Colorado was such a target rich environment. I thought you were a law abiding person who believed in strict limits on the Second Amendment. You are not one of those guys who says, "Everyone else, but me," are you?

Might want to know what you ate talking about before you let your finger loose on the keyboard. Texas law does not prevent carry in theaters. Not to mention we were talking about federal laws and you are now talking about state laws. Nice try though.

kenpoprofessor · 12-09-2012, 15:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kingarthurhk

There is a long standing Supreme Court ruling on that. A farmer was growing crops on his own land and wasn't crossing interstate lines, and he was disallowed to grow or sell crops. This happened in the early part of the last century. It still stands that the government can order you not to grow crops on your own property.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wickard_v._Filburn

Have a great gun carryin' Kenpo day

Clyde

LawScholar · 12-09-2012, 15:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruble Noon

I might have to because statist's like you have destroyed freedom in this country.

If you're not a fan of organized society, why not retire to the tropical anarchist's paradise of Somalia?

Nowhere else but on the Internet does not wanting every irresponsible moron at Wal-Mart to have a Minuteman silo and a Mark 19 make a person a statist.