Home Forums Classifieds Blogs Today's Posts Search Social Groups



  
SIGN-UP
Notices

Glock Talk
Welcome To The Glock Talk Forums.

 
  
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-04-2012, 21:35   #181
schapman43
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 661
Thanks for keeping us updated.
__________________
Self Sufficient Living

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.

"KEEP YOUR BOOGER HOOK OFF THE BANG SWITCH!" ~~Kingfish
schapman43 is offline  
Old 12-04-2012, 21:58   #182
NCHeel
Senior Member
 
NCHeel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Charlotte N.C.
Posts: 465
Quote:
Originally Posted by CCBBKK View Post
Having minimal engagement between the trigger bar and the firing pin lug can result in double fires. Did you ever experience this while shooting this pistol?
He only has ran about 150 rounds through it with no problems. I asked the same question earlier.
__________________
Gen4 G17, G19, G26. Love the Gen4's.

Glock and S&W M&P Certified Armorer
NRA certified RSO
NRA Instructor for pistol, rifle, shotgun & PPIH and PPOH
NCHeel is offline  
Old 12-04-2012, 22:19   #183
LampShadeActual
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 233
Obviously not there, obviously no first hand knowledge.

If you tell me a Glock left Gaston's place with so little engagement of the trigger bar and firing pin tang, it tingles my BS meter.

If the drop safety shelf doesn't keep the trigger bar from dropping off the tang, you double my BS meter tingle.

Now you add in that since #1 and #2 failed and the striker was released. AND the gun fired because #3 the firing pin safety spring was bent and not functioning the firing pin safety designed to prevent precise that exact such accidental firing.

On calm reflection, not giving a rats shinny axx either way, you have just asked me to believe too many items in a chain. To believe that story runs counter to the usual wisdom that the simplest answer is almost always the true one. All three mechanical systems were misfitted or failed or damaged in assembly at the factory???

I think not. I don't know what did happen, but I think that the chain of #1, #2, #3 did not happen.

Last edited by LampShadeActual; 12-04-2012 at 22:21..
LampShadeActual is offline  
Old 12-04-2012, 22:39   #184
oldman11
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Texas
Posts: 2,896
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alter-Ego View Post
Well I'm pretty sure Glocks are number 1 for AD, regardless of holster, traning, experience, ect.... Glocks seems to be the most common demominator when you hear of AD.
Yeah, it's called "operator error"
oldman11 is offline  
Old 12-04-2012, 22:39   #185
00Glazz
Senior Member
 
00Glazz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 329
Quote:
Originally Posted by LampShadeActual View Post
Obviously not there, obviously no first hand knowledge.

If you tell me a Glock left Gaston's place with so little engagement of the trigger bar and firing pin tang, it tingles my BS meter.

If the drop safety shelf doesn't keep the trigger bar from dropping off the tang, you double my BS meter tingle.

Now you add in that since #1 and #2 failed and the striker was released. AND the gun fired because #3 the firing pin safety spring was bent and not functioning the firing pin safety designed to prevent precise that exact such accidental firing.

On calm reflection, not giving a rats shinny axx either way, you have just asked me to believe too many items in a chain. To believe that story runs counter to the usual wisdom that the simplest answer is almost always the true one. All three mechanical systems were misfitted or failed or damaged in assembly at the factory???

I think not. I don't know what did happen, but I think that the chain of #1, #2, #3 did not happen.
That is fine, either way you can believe what you want. I am not saying anything against that... I am just saying I do not think insinuating that I am lying or BS-ing for the fun of it is very beneficial to this thread.

I too agree that it is a very remote and one in a billion chance thing to happen, but the fact of the matter is, SOMETHING that was not my finger pulling the trigger, or a foreign object (AFAIK) pulling the trigger, caused my weapon to fire, into my living room wall. When I am being told that #1 and #2 are defect and that it is a high chance that it is what caused this, I am going to hope/believe that it is indeed the case.

Either way, it is defect. Whether it caused the AD or not it still needs replaced and it is ridiculous that it came through the line to me.

Last edited by 00Glazz; 12-04-2012 at 22:40.. Reason: apparently I couldn't spell caused..
00Glazz is offline  
Old 12-04-2012, 22:46   #186
NCHeel
Senior Member
 
NCHeel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Charlotte N.C.
Posts: 465
Quote:
Originally Posted by LampShadeActual View Post

If the drop safety shelf doesn't keep the trigger bar from dropping off the tang, you double my BS meter tingle.
That doesn't need to happen. If there is minimal engagement the trigger bar can be rock solid but the firing pin lug can travel upwards, freeing itself. On a pistol with proper sear engagement there is not enough freedom of movement for the lug to disconnect and the drop safety works properly. Why do you think there is a factory spec minimum engagement percentage for the lug to the cruciform?

One reason is to not have a runaway gun. The other is to make sure the drop safety is operational.
__________________
Gen4 G17, G19, G26. Love the Gen4's.

Glock and S&W M&P Certified Armorer
NRA certified RSO
NRA Instructor for pistol, rifle, shotgun & PPIH and PPOH

Last edited by NCHeel; 12-04-2012 at 22:50..
NCHeel is offline  
Old 12-04-2012, 22:46   #187
jack76590
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,155
What is the speculation on the affect of the bent firing pin safety spring?

Did the bent spring cause the firing pin safety to get jammed in the "off position"?

Or was the pressure so weak on the firing pin safety that the safety moved as a result of dropping the glock, or the pressure on the firing pin safety was so weak that the striker just pushed it up and away?

If you want to add another potential factor into the equation, was the plating on the firing pin safety flaking off? I have replaced a couple of firing pin safeties because of flaking and fear that the flakes could cause the firing pin safety to jam in the off position. Even grease could cause the firing pin safety to jam in the off position and it could still jump down under recoil.

When I clean my glock and prior to loading I check to assure the firing pin safety is operating and in the on position. In short I can envision a lot of reasons for the firing pin safety to not be engaged.

Last edited by jack76590; 12-04-2012 at 22:50..
jack76590 is offline  
Old 12-04-2012, 23:13   #188
.38 super
Observer
 
.38 super's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,859
cglaspel, remind me again please:

1. Did you remove the anti-seize compound when you clean the gun for first time and what you used to lube it after this.

2. Did you have any contact with the holster when the discharge happened ?

Don't take it personally, the reason they are looking at your actions is because 99% of the time it's the human element, not the machine...
__________________
Μολων λαβε !
____________________________
Florida Glockers Club #1964
Калашников Клуб №1000
.38 super is offline  
Old 12-04-2012, 23:19   #189
.38 super
Observer
 
.38 super's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,859
Quote:
Originally Posted by jack76590 View Post
What is the speculation on the affect of the bent firing pin safety spring?.
...I will speculate that it didn't came this way from the factory.
__________________
Μολων λαβε !
____________________________
Florida Glockers Club #1964
Калашников Клуб №1000
.38 super is offline  
Old 12-04-2012, 23:25   #190
jack76590
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,155
Quote:
Originally Posted by .38 super View Post
...I will speculate that it didn't came this way from the factory.
Quite possible the firing pin safety spring was bent after it left the factory. Still I would like to know what are the affects of a bent firing pin safety spring.

I check my firing pin safety every cleaning and if there is something I should be looking for other then pressure and movement, I would like to know.
jack76590 is offline  
Old 12-04-2012, 23:36   #191
00Glazz
Senior Member
 
00Glazz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 329
Quote:
Originally Posted by .38 super View Post
cglaspel, remind me again please:

1. Did you remove the anti-seize compound when you clean the gun for first time and what you used to lube it after this.

2. Did you have any contact with the holster when the discharge happened ?

Don't take it personally, the reason they are looking at your actions is because 99% of the time it's the human element, not the machine...
Sorry .38 super, must have lost your questions in the mix.

1. The store I bought it from had already removed 90% of it, there was very little for me to remove after I purchased it (Fin, Feather, Fur in Ashland was where I purchased btw)

I personally cleaned and lubricated it with Hoppes #9 gun cleaner, and Hoppes Oil.

2. The discharge happend as I was setting the holster/weapon down, I was about to take my hand off the weapon completely and turn to walk into my kitchen and it fired.

Had to edit this because after thinking about it, i still had contact with the grip frame slightly when it fired.

Last edited by 00Glazz; 12-04-2012 at 23:53..
00Glazz is offline  
Old 12-04-2012, 23:43   #192
tonyparson
Senior Member
 
tonyparson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Dayton, TN.
Posts: 5,271
Quote:
Originally Posted by cglaspel View Post
Sorry .38 super, must have lost your questions in the mix.

1. The store I bought it from had already removed 90% of it, there was very little for me to remove after I purchased it (Fin, Feather, Fur in Ashland was where I purchased btw)

I personally cleaned and lubricated it with Hoppes #9 gun cleaner, and Hoppes Oil.

2. Besides taking my holster off of my person, after I set it on the table I had no contact with the holster/weapon when it went off. My hand was completely off of the holster/weapon and I was turning to walk into my kitchen when it happened.
Why would the gun shop clean the copper lube off a new Glock? Did you ever get the pictures of the holster after the AD? im wanting to see what damage it caused.
__________________
When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.......
Thomas Jefferson
tonyparson is offline  
Old 12-04-2012, 23:49   #193
00Glazz
Senior Member
 
00Glazz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 329
Every shop I have ever purchased from around here has cleaned and wiped down their pistols before putting them in the case? I didn't realize that wasnt normal tbh? I have watched some of them wiping them down as soon as they get their order in and log all of them.

No I did not, havent had time to get a camera since I worked most of the day. The scratches arent significant damage. It is near the bottom of the holster where the front sight looks like it came up and scraped the holster slightly is all.

The push button is just a little more loose than normal, nothing you can see. You would have to push on it to tell the difference.

If I can get my hands on a camera that will show the scratches though I will post the pics!
00Glazz is offline  
Old 12-04-2012, 23:56   #194
tonyparson
Senior Member
 
tonyparson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Dayton, TN.
Posts: 5,271
Quote:
Originally Posted by cglaspel View Post
Every shop I have ever purchased from around here has cleaned and wiped down their pistols before putting them in the case? I didn't realize that wasnt normal tbh? I have watched some of them wiping them down as soon as they get their order in and log all of them.

No I did not, havent had time to get a camera since I worked most of the day. The scratches arent significant damage. It is near the bottom of the holster where the front sight looks like it came up and scraped the holster slightly is all.

The push button is just a little more loose than normal, nothing you can see. You would have to push on it to tell the difference.

If I can get my hands on a camera that will show the scratches though I will post the pics!
The Glock owners manual says to leave the copper lube in the gun for as long as you can.
__________________
When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.......
Thomas Jefferson
tonyparson is offline  
Old 12-05-2012, 00:09   #195
INEEDMILK
Senior Member
 
INEEDMILK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 755
This is all pretty unbelievable. I doubt Glock would have shipped the gun in that state considering it would take a combination of poorly manufactured parts AND a mis-installed part for this to occur.

I'm guessing either the OP took the gun apart and did not reassemble it properly, or someone at the gun store where he bought it tried a little tinkering one day because he was bored.
__________________
Glock 17 RTF2 G
Glock 19 RTF2 G


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
INEEDMILK is offline  
Old 12-05-2012, 00:19   #196
jack76590
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,155
Question for OP. How many rounds had you fired thru the glock before this incident?

I ask because I would guess, if you fired several hundred rounds, that at some point the striker would not have engaged given the weak engagement point.

Last edited by jack76590; 12-05-2012 at 00:19..
jack76590 is offline  
Old 12-05-2012, 00:25   #197
INEEDMILK
Senior Member
 
INEEDMILK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 755
Quote:
Originally Posted by jack76590 View Post
Question for OP. How many rounds had you fired thru the glock before this incident?

I ask because I would guess, if you fired several hundred rounds, that at some point the striker would not have engaged given the weak engagement point.
I think he said ~150 somewhere earlier in this thread.
__________________
Glock 17 RTF2 G
Glock 19 RTF2 G


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
INEEDMILK is offline  
Old 12-05-2012, 05:48   #198
clarkz71
Senior Member
 
clarkz71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: South Florida
Posts: 1,608
Quote:
Originally Posted by eaglefrq View Post

I could draw, slingshot and fire two rounds in less than 3 seconds.
That's pretty quick, thank you for your service.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cglaspel View Post
Sorry .38 super, must have lost your questions in the mix.

1. The store I bought it from had already removed 90% of it, there was very little for me to remove after I purchased it (Fin, Feather, Fur in Ashland was where I purchased btw)
Not supposed to remove the copper lube.
They also had your slide off to do that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyparson View Post
Why would the gun shop clean the copper lube off a new Glock?
Exactly, the plot thickens

Quote:
Originally Posted by cglaspel View Post
Every shop I have ever purchased from around here has cleaned and wiped down their pistols before putting them in the case? I didn't realize that wasnt normal tbh? I have watched some of them wiping them down as soon as they get their order in and log all of them.
Wiping the guns down is OK, removing the copper lube
should be left to the purchaser. Some want it on there.


Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyparson View Post
The Glock owners manual says to leave the copper lube in the gun for as long as you can.
Right, that's what I mean in my post above.
__________________
Quote:
Real Men of Genius....Here's to you, Mister self proclaimed-genius-surrounded by idiots!
.
G23 gen3 .40/.357 Sig
Florida Glocker #1923
clarkz71 is online now  
Old 12-05-2012, 06:15   #199
eaglefrq
NRA Member
 
eaglefrq's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 1,282
Quote:
Originally Posted by clarkz71 View Post
Not supposed to remove the copper lube.
They also had your slide off to do that.
I didn't know you were supposed to leave the copper lube on as long as possible. I haven't looked at my owners manual in years.

I'm one of those guys that buys a gun and takes it to the range immediately and tries (not always successful) to put 500 rounds through it. Then I go home and thoroughly clean it.

My wife doesn't mind, she knows I'll be out of the house for a while, so I won't interrupt her craft time.
__________________
You are free to choose, but you are not free from the consequence of your choice.
eaglefrq is offline  
Old 12-05-2012, 06:15   #200
mrdinks
Member
 
mrdinks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Iowa
Posts: 87
Good, now I can take the tin foil off my head and dig my Serpa out of the garbage.

On a serious note, thanks for the update and your calm demeanor through all these remarks. It can be tough to bring up things like this because all the r#t*rds come out of the closet to point fingers.
Thanks for the eye opener.
__________________
NRA Life Member
Iowa Firearms Coalition Supporting Member
GSSF Member
Professional Firefighter IAFF Local 11
Locksmith
mrdinks is offline  

 
  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 22:29.




Homepage
FAQ
Forums
Calendar
Advertise
Gallery
GT Wiki
GT Blogs
Social Groups
Classifieds


Users Currently Online: 1,256
353 Members
903 Guests

Most users ever online: 2,672
Aug 11, 2014 at 2:31