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Old 11-26-2012, 16:43   #26
Gallium
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To the OP, you are making a slew of assumptions. As DD has pointed out, ALL OF US have some sort of value system, and NONE OF US places all humans at the same value on that scale.

With regards to this tragic loss of life? I don't know if the 16yr old was developmentally delayed (ie, mentally). Would your opinion change if it was a 6yr old kid?
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Old 11-26-2012, 16:46   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fnfalman View Post
That may be your personal belief, but it isn't mine.

I'd risk my life to save my pets. I don't necessarily feel the same about other humans or even some of my own family members.
I agree.
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Old 11-26-2012, 16:46   #28
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Originally Posted by itisbruno View Post
My dog can swim.

Hell, he could pull me out with that little stick.
Pretty much any animal can swim.
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Old 11-26-2012, 16:47   #29
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Originally Posted by fnfalman View Post
What does my being a carnivore have to do with my pets?

Do you eat your pets on a regular basis?

My pets give me comfort and entertainment. My pets don't vote for Democrats or Republicans. My pets don't go and rape & kill others because of religious beliefs.
That's how it starts: eating his pets. Next thing, he'll be eating his children.
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Old 11-26-2012, 16:48   #30
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Originally Posted by el_jewapo View Post
Pretty much any animal can swim.
tous can't

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Old 11-26-2012, 16:50   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by devildog2067 View Post
You make a fallacious assumption. I'm guessing that fnfalman would agree wtih the idea that not all animal life (and not all human life) has the same value.

I wouldn't eat my pets. I wouldn't kill my family. But I would eat some animals and I would kill some people.

I have to agree with this.

Decisions have to be based on personal priorities.
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Old 11-26-2012, 16:51   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by el_jewapo View Post
Pretty much any animal can swim.

Even a manatee?
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Old 11-26-2012, 17:04   #33
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Originally Posted by Kingarthurhk View Post
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/11/26...g-to-save-dog/

Ironically, the only survivor was the dog. When people overly anthropomorphize animals into pseudo-humans, this sort of thing happens. No dog is worth the death of an entire family.
We all evaluate risks. I'm sure if the family could all come back in place of the dog they would. So what is your point exactly?

Nice to see GNG supports the idea that your logic sucks.
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Old 11-26-2012, 17:07   #34
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The family didn't die trying to save the dog.

The 16 year old boy tried to save the dog, then returned to shore. Good judgment.

The family tried to save each other, the dog was not an issue. Their efforts were valiant, but futile.
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Old 11-26-2012, 17:17   #35
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Originally Posted by Kingarthurhk View Post
That is some really sad priorities that you value animal life above humans and your own family. Are you vegan, and do you avoid all animal products? If not, it would appear your ethics and priorities are more tangled than twenty year old christmas lights.
That..... is stupid.

You judge his ethics and priorities based on a flip comment on the web. Accuse him of being vegan because he'd risk himself to save his pet?

I got news for you, I'd risk my life to save my little buddies. Hell, I'd risk YOUR life to save them.

Why?

I love my dogs, they make me feel better after a bad day when they both jump in my lap and burrow their heads into my neck and wiggle with pleasure as I scratch them. You're just another judgmental A-hole in a hat.

I know far too many people I wouldn't piddle on if they was on fire, I never met a dog that made me feel that way.

Now you have someone to judge.
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Old 11-26-2012, 17:25   #36
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Originally Posted by Glock20 10mm View Post
But they are not humans, they do not have human thought process and they are low on the hierarchy of value when it comes to life choices.
That about sums it up for me, too. I've had many dogs over the years and I loved them all. Your dog is the only animal in the world that would rather be with you than with other dogs. Dog spelled backwards is... and all that. Heck, I even carry "doggy treats" in my glove box... for dogs I've never met.

But, no, they are not humans. I think human life has a much greater value.
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Old 11-26-2012, 17:33   #37
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Originally Posted by Gallium View Post
Even a manatee?
With or without the stolen tablet?
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Old 11-26-2012, 18:47   #38
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For those who would risk their life to save an animal (any animal including pets), feel free to answer this question:

Assuming that you have family/friends who love you and/or rely on you to keep them safe, do you think that they will miss you and mourn your death more than that animal you tried to save?

OR, would your loving spouse, child, mother, father, brother, sister, close friend etc. mourn the loss of YOUR life more than that of the animal if you we're to lose YOUR life trying to save an animal (especially a pet)?

Just how selfish would you be if you were to sacrafice your life over that of a family pet or any animal?

In the story posted by the OP there is 2 survivors, the young daughter who called 911 and watched her ENTIRE FAMILY drown, and the dog. This girl will live her entire life without the love and comfort of her family. Do any of you animal lovers think that the death of this girl's mother, father and brother worth their ultimate sacrafice trying to save one stinkin' dog?
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Last edited by Merkavaboy; 11-26-2012 at 18:53..
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Old 11-26-2012, 18:48   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fnfalman View Post
That may be your personal belief, but it isn't mine.

I'd risk my life to save my pets. I don't necessarily feel the same about other humans or even some of my own family members.
we agree

our pets are family period .
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Old 11-26-2012, 18:55   #40
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Originally Posted by janice6 View Post
The family didn't die trying to save the dog.

The 16 year old boy tried to save the dog, then returned to shore. Good judgment.

The family tried to save each other, the dog was not an issue. Their efforts were valiant, but futile.
This. Nobody died trying to save the dog.

The only individuals that died were the ones trying to save their human family members.
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Old 11-26-2012, 19:01   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merkavaboy View Post
For those who would risk their life to save an animal (any animal including pets), feel free to answer this question:
Why do you insist that others should have the same values as you?
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Old 11-26-2012, 19:10   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingarthurhk View Post
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/11/26...g-to-save-dog/

Ironically, the only survivor was the dog. When people overly anthropomorphize animals into pseudo-humans, this sort of thing happens. No dog is worth the death of an entire family.
agreed, saw that animals are animals yeah we fall in love with them but thats just it they are still animals. If I could with a Minimum of risk save a pet I would do it..but if id have to honestly have to risk mine or a family members life to do so thats when you have to remember that no matter how attached we get that they are just that Animals and not worth risking life for IMO. of course others will have different opinions...thats fine...I dont insist that they agree with me...do I think its foolish to value our pets lives as much as ours yes. I think God gave humans something special he didnt give to animals...and thus I value human life over animals. (Well most human life I should say there are some that would never be worth saving but thats another subject...( im not talking criminals,dirt bags, etc or any of those types)


I read that article earlier today and quickly thought..nope id not have done that id have stopped the rest of my family from doing that either. Id have felt horrible but i also known id have made the right decision.

Last edited by CBennett; 11-26-2012 at 19:17..
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Old 11-26-2012, 19:15   #43
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Originally Posted by el_jewapo View Post
Pretty much any animal can swim.
I've seen the DNA and I really don't think squatches can swim.
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Old 11-26-2012, 19:17   #44
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Originally Posted by Merkavaboy View Post
For those who would risk their life to save a stranger, feel free to answer this question:

Assuming that you have family/friends who love you and/or rely on you to keep them safe, do you think that they will miss you and mourn your death more than that stranger you tried to save?

OR, would your loving spouse, child, mother, father, brother, sister, close friend etc. mourn the loss of YOUR life more than that of the stranger if you we're to lose YOUR life trying to save a stranger?

Just how selfish would you be if you were to sacrafice your life over that of a stranger?
I've changed one word, but you could still apply that exact same logic. So I guess all those people who risk their lives to save strangers are a bunch of selfish A-holes too, huh?
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Old 11-26-2012, 19:30   #45
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Originally Posted by Kingarthurhk View Post
[URL] No dog is worth the death of an entire family.
I've got some inlaws I trade for a dead dog any day of the week.
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Old 11-26-2012, 20:10   #46
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agreed, saw that animals are animals yeah we fall in love with them but thats just it they are still animals. If I could with a Minimum of risk save a pet I would do it..but if id have to honestly have to risk mine or a family members life to do so thats when you have to remember that no matter how attached we get that they are just that Animals and not worth risking life for IMO. of course others will have different opinions...thats fine...I dont insist that they agree with me...do I think its foolish to value our pets lives as much as ours yes. I think God gave humans something special he didnt give to animals...and thus I value human life over animals. (Well most human life I should say there are some that would never be worth saving but thats another subject...( im not talking criminals,dirt bags, etc or any of those types)


I read that article earlier today and quickly thought..nope id not have done that id have stopped the rest of my family from doing that either. Id have felt horrible but i also known id have made the right decision.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Merkavaboy View Post
For those who would risk their life to save an animal (any animal including pets), feel free to answer this question:

Assuming that you have family/friends who love you and/or rely on you to keep them safe, do you think that they will miss you and mourn your death more than that animal you tried to save?

OR, would your loving spouse, child, mother, father, brother, sister, close friend etc. mourn the loss of YOUR life more than that of the animal if you we're to lose YOUR life trying to save an animal (especially a pet)?

Just how selfish would you be if you were to sacrafice your life over that of a family pet or any animal?

In the story posted by the OP there is 2 survivors, the young daughter who called 911 and watched her ENTIRE FAMILY drown, and the dog. This girl will live her entire life without the love and comfort of her family. Do any of you animal lovers think that the death of this girl's mother, father and brother worth their ultimate sacrafice trying to save one stinkin' dog?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glock20 10mm View Post
My dogs have a job, if they die in the execution of their job then so be it. I don't get emotionally attached to animals. I respect them, appreciate their service and make their life as comfortable and loving as realistically possible.

But they are not humans, they do not have human thought process and they are low on the hierarchy of value when it comes to life choices.
No animal is worth risking even the most worthless human life over IMO. I love my dog and cat, but the only way I'd try to save them is if there was no risk to my life. Animals do not have a soul. Even the most worthless human has a soul and possibly one day they will come to know Jesus and be saved. No animal can ever do that.

If my pet gets sick, I can and will put a bullet in it's brain without a thought. For instance a few years ago an adult cat we adopted got leukemia. After a consult with a vet, I took it home, put a piece of it's favorite food in front of it, and while the cat was eating I put him down. Done the same to other pets over the years. Would never do something like that to a human, unless they were a threat to me or my loved ones.
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Old 11-26-2012, 20:11   #47
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I am admittedly overly attached to my pets. My wife and I are freaks who easentialy treat our pets like our kids. We loce our pets. I like my pets more than most people. I would indeed risk my life for my pets.

But the reality is this: they are not people, they are animals. As such, this fact trumps my emotions.
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Old 11-26-2012, 20:14   #48
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I've seen the DNA and I really don't think squatches can swim.
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Old 11-26-2012, 20:18   #49
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I like my dog more than I like most people. She will protect me, and I will protect her, if I can.
I feel the same way about my cats. What's weird is a few years ago I wasn't a animal person. I even called someone stupid in a old thread that died in the process of trying to save their dog.

Man how things change. I never had pets when I was a kid so I never understood the bond there was to be had with them. One little kitty came into my life and changed that. Now I can't think of life without them.

I would die saving my cats. People can call me what they will but I don't care. I was that person once and believe me I understand that they aren't able to relate or understand how we feel about it. They give us unconditional love and represent everything that us humans should be but often aren't.

I'm glad for and I'm forever grateful to that sweet little kitty that came into my life and changed me forever. God rest him.
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Old 11-26-2012, 20:20   #50
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Originally Posted by Caver 60 View Post
Animals do not have a soul.
I don't want to get into a Religious debate here but that isn't true. In fact, our pets will be with us in heaven.

Please feel free to PM me for further information.

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