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Old 11-02-2012, 08:24   #51
k9medic
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Some people think they are "bad" but when the "bad" get together, the SEALs, SF guys, MARSOC, TAC-P and Task Force guys are called Boss.

Each element is trained for a particular set or subset of missions. I have friends in all but the SEALs. Each guy is his own guy and contrary to any story told here in the hall of GT, no one tends to brag. These guys move on in the private sector to companies that many have never heard of and continue to do jobs like what they have done in the military.

Some keep a high profile and others just blend in and transition into a normal job just like the rest of us.
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Old 11-02-2012, 09:44   #52
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Originally Posted by Foxtrotx1 View Post

Pretty sure he was being facetious.
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Old 11-02-2012, 09:57   #53
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I don't know about Delta being secretive. My experience with them is they tend to brag a lot, but just aren't very specific about where they've done stuff. I guess you could say that is kinda secretive.

They also do a different kind of training that must help them stay low profile. When you look at them, they seem kinda over weight, and you wouldn't intially think they are serious fighters. But they must obviously still be in top shape and ready, as the Delta guys I know are on call from some top commander. They have to be ready to go at a moment's notice, even when relaxing at the local bar, where I happened upon them and realized they were Delta after talking to them.
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Old 11-02-2012, 10:04   #54
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I thought the SEALs did a pretty decent job acting, I mean considering their other skill sets to be able to act at all is pretty impressive IMO.
The ability to blend in might be part of the training. I have a friend who was in the SAS and during his training he had to traverse one extreme point in England to another with no money or resources while eluding another SAS member whose mission was to track him down. I'm sure some ability to act is the difference between success and failure.
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Old 11-02-2012, 10:06   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ithaca_deerslayer View Post
What about the Green Berets? I'm a John Wayne fan, so they must be the best.
Different missions. Seals/Delta are strike troops. GB are hearts/minds win the population types. At least that's there base mission.
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Old 11-02-2012, 10:23   #56
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Different missions. Seals/Delta are strike troops. GB are hearts/minds win the population types. At least that's there base mission.
This is what people don't understand.

The US has the ability to use the right unit for the job at hand.

Delta, SEALs Force Recon, Rangers, Airborne, Air Mobil Assault, Marine Infantry, Army Heavy Infantry etc. All different capabilities and areas of expertise. Granted there is a lot of cross over but when possible the unit can be tailored to the mission.
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Old 11-02-2012, 10:44   #57
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Originally Posted by Hauptmann6 View Post
Different missions. Seals/Delta are strike troops. GB are hearts/minds win the population types. At least that's there base mission.
A lot of people miss this point. Comparing these units on the basis of "badassness" isn't really valid, any more than comparing a tricked out 4WD vehicle with a tricked out sports car is valid.

If you need a self-contained, highly mobile, elite strike team for precision missions, generally SEALS or Delta are a good call.

If you want some guys to go into the mountains and spend 12 months training friendly tribal groups to fight the Taliban in Northern A-Stan, you send in Green Berets.

If a plane gets shot down in enemy territory and a pilot needs immediate rescue, you send whoever is closest and can get there ready to fight the fastest.
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Old 11-02-2012, 11:36   #58
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If you need a self-contained, highly mobile, elite strike team for precision missions, generally SEALS or Delta are a good call.
Are you also not understanding that there is a difference between a CAG operator (Tier I) and a SEAL (Tier II)?

You are correct to point out the FID/COIN/Force Multiplier mission of Special Forces, but do you not also realize that a big part of the SEALs bread and butter is beach surveys and amphibious recon?

The GWOT has everyone doing Direct Action missions, because the military just isn't big enough, but once we leave Afghanistan and things start to calm down, you will see a return to the traditional roles of the different SOF elements.
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Old 11-02-2012, 11:49   #59
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Originally Posted by KalashniKEV View Post
Are you also not understanding that there is a difference between a CAG operator (Tier I) and a SEAL (Tier II)?

You are correct to point out the FID/COIN/Force Multiplier mission of Special Forces, but do you not also realize that a big part of the SEALs bread and butter is beach surveys and amphibious recon?

The GWOT has everyone doing Direct Action missions, because the military just isn't big enough, but once we leave Afghanistan and things start to calm down, you will see a return to the traditional roles of the different SOF elements.
I'm fully aware of the actual designations of the units under discussion, but use the terms "Delta" and SEALS" because that's what the thread title utilizes and that's what the members here are primarily going with, rather than DEVGRU and ACE*.

BTW - 1st SFOD-D isn't referred to as "CAG" (Combat Applications Group) anymore, but has had their designation changed to "ACE" (Army Compartmented Elements) and has been referred to as such since 2010.


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Old 11-02-2012, 11:54   #60
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This is a silly topic. My opinion on who is better, tougher, or more badass would be based on what I've read, what I've seen on the Military Channel, and a brief encounter with some SEALs about ten years ago. In other words: worthless.

I assume most of the posters in this thread would have about as much insight as I do.

The reality is that if you have reached the status of Delta, CAG, or the other SOF units, you could care less about arguing over who is better (other than for ball busting purposes within their community).


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Old 11-02-2012, 11:56   #61
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Originally Posted by tsmo1066 View Post
BTW - 1st SFOD-D isn't referred to as "CAG" (Combat Applications Group) anymore, but has had their designation changed to "ACE" (Army Compartmented Elements) and has been referred to as such since 2010.


Yes, I was aware but didn't want to confuse the discussion further. Old habits die hard as well.

"Delta Force" = CAG = ACE

[ DEVGRU = "SEAL Team 6" ] > SEAL
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Old 11-02-2012, 12:04   #62
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Originally Posted by tsmo1066 View Post
BTW - 1st SFOD-D isn't referred to as "CAG" (Combat Applications Group) anymore, but has had their designation changed to "ACE" (Army Compartmented Elements) and has been referred to as such since 2010.


Thanks for that! I still refer to them as CAG.

It's hard to change that.
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Old 11-02-2012, 12:05   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KalashniKEV View Post
Yes, I was aware but didn't want to confuse the discussion further. Old habits die hard as well.

"Delta Force" = CAG = ACE

[ DEVGRU = "SEAL Team 6" ] > SEAL
I always hated "CAG" anyway...always sounds like one is discussing a Naval Air Group Commander.

"ACE" has a good ring to it, but sounds like one of those acronyms that the military sometimes comes up with just to sound cool...like the "HAWK" missile ("Homing All the Way Killer").

I mean, seriously - Army Compartmented Elements???
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Old 11-02-2012, 12:18   #64
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I still refer to them as CAG.

It's hard to change that.
+1

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsmo1066 View Post
I mean, seriously - Army Compartmentalized Elements???
I think of this:

The Okie Corral

and then I think of this:

The Okie Corral

and then I think of this:

The Okie Corral

and then I think of this:

The Okie Corral

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Old 11-02-2012, 12:23   #65
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I've met men from both and you would never know from them who or what they are. The SEALs would rather not have the press they get.

I was in acls class with 2 "men who don't exist" the only thing that set them apart was the relaxed grooming standards and the high speed pagers at the time, this was in the early 90's when pagers were popular and cell phones were bulky. I asked one guy about the pager as I had never seen one with a screen before. He told me it was for on call coverage for the TMC, yeah right. I was at night, but the night before said this.

As to who is tougher. Who cares? They are both awe inspiring and I will never be one of them. I salute the quiet professionals.
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Old 11-02-2012, 12:31   #66
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I found this link a tad more interesting:
http://dsc.discovery.com/life/13-sex...ouldnt-be.html


What group is tougher is impossible to say. My understanding is you have to get to an elite unit to have a chance at Delta=Delta would be the best (and the CIA's group).

"Tougher" is impossible to quanitify.
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Old 11-02-2012, 12:35   #67
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Well, they've got the medals, corporal stripes, captain's bars, and shoulder epaulets to prove it. I had never heard of a corporal captain before.
Ever watch MASH? When hawkeye picks up BJ with Radar in tow?
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Old 11-02-2012, 12:37   #68
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I don't know about Delta being secretive. My experience with them is they tend to brag a lot, but just aren't very specific about where they've done stuff. I guess you could say that is kinda secretive.

They also do a different kind of training that must help them stay low profile. When you look at them, they seem kinda over weight, and you wouldn't intially think they are serious fighters. But they must obviously still be in top shape and ready, as the Delta guys I know are on call from some top commander. They have to be ready to go at a moment's notice, even when relaxing at the local bar, where I happened upon them and realized they were Delta after talking to them.
Did they let you shoot their DD-214? How awesome was that? A blast I bet.
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Old 11-02-2012, 12:52   #69
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Brave men who go through training 99% of us here wouldn't be able to complete. Who cares who is better as long as they are both giving extreme islamists dirt naps. God bless them.
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Old 11-02-2012, 14:00   #70
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Originally Posted by k9medic View Post
Some people think they are "bad" but when the "bad" get together, the SEALs, SF guys, MARSOC, TAC-P and Task Force guys are called Boss.

Each element is trained for a particular set or subset of missions. I have friends in all but the SEALs. Each guy is his own guy and contrary to any story told here in the hall of GT, no one tends to brag. These guys move on in the private sector to companies that many have never heard of and continue to do jobs like what they have done in the military.

Some keep a high profile and others just blend in and transition into a normal job just like the rest of us.
Not all the time.
My late ex-house guest was a retired SF operator on a 'Nam Mike Force team. He worked as as a toy department supervisor at Wal mart.

I Ran The Pipline and earned my maroon beret. Allergies took me out of the team. I retired from the local water department.
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Old 11-02-2012, 14:07   #71
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SEALs have to star in their own movies.

Chuck Norris only gets to pretend he is Delta.

Case closed.
Actually, Delta Force, with Chuck Norris, was a documentary.
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Old 11-02-2012, 14:36   #72
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Not all the time.
Well then he would be one of those who "just blend in and transition into a normal job just like the rest of us."

Remember the Ray Davis incident?

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Old 11-02-2012, 14:51   #73
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SEALs have to star in their own movies.

Chuck Norris only gets to pretend he is Delta.

Case closed.
You just went to the top of Chuck's **** list!

Hear those footsteps behind you?

No?

Well you won't. .

If you don't hear footsteps, it's Chuck coming for you.

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Old 11-02-2012, 14:59   #74
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So, the discussion really should be DEVGRU vrs. Delta.

I vote DEVGRU, because I'm currently playing as a SEAL Assaulter in MOH Warfighter.

Which, by the way, is an awesome game.
Needs a lot more polish, but the core is there.
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Old 11-02-2012, 15:24   #75
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Originally Posted by k9medic View Post
Some people think they are "bad" but when the "bad" get together, the SEALs, SF guys, MARSOC, TAC-P and Task Force guys are called Boss.

Each element is trained for a particular set or subset of missions. I have friends in all but the SEALs. Each guy is his own guy and contrary to any story told here in the hall of GT, no one tends to brag. These guys move on in the private sector to companies that many have never heard of and continue to do jobs like what they have done in the military.

Some keep a high profile and others just blend in and transition into a normal job just like the rest of us.
A buddy of mine just stopped by for a couple minutes and I mentioned this. He has been in Delta for about 20 years now. He said the only SEAL team that is comparable is of course SEAL team 6. He said only when something leaks out do people ever hear about team 6. He said he has worked with them only plenty occasions in Delta. He also mentioned MARSOC and TAC-P and I think something about the air force medics are about the best in the world, and get air dropped in. He tells me some stories that are mindblowing when he's in the mood.

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