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Old 10-10-2012, 06:09   #26
diamondd2
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So where are all the range reports for the new Apex extractor?
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Old 10-10-2012, 06:17   #27
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I was just about to ask the same question.
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Old 10-10-2012, 06:40   #28
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Originally Posted by diamondd2 View Post
So where are all the range reports for the new Apex extractor?
So far I've only tried the Apex extractor with factory SLB. I did not install the extractor plunger spring that came with the Apex unit. The Apex extractor looks exactly like the old cast non LCI glock extractors. I'm going to try the Apex with the old style non lci SLB since it will put more tension on the extractor. I'll report back
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Old 10-10-2012, 06:58   #29
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Originally Posted by DannyR View Post
I was just about to ask the same question.

Some are at M4Carbine.net where their members had first dibs...
http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=87993


DannyR, you seem like you want them to fail and are in denial of the brass to the face problem.
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Old 10-10-2012, 07:45   #30
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I do not wish them to fail, but am only curious if they really are an improvement. No more, no less.

There are three variables that may cause brass to the face:

1. Firearm
2. Operator
3. Ammo
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Last edited by DannyR; 10-10-2012 at 07:46..
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Old 10-10-2012, 07:50   #31
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Originally Posted by DannyR View Post
I do not wish them to fail, but am only curious if they really are an improvement. No more, no less.

There are three variables that may cause brass to the face:

1. Firearm
2. Operator
3. Ammo
So when 1,2,& 3 have been the same on a pistol from round number 1, why would the brass to the face start after 2K + rounds through the pistol?

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Last edited by Fire_Medic; 10-10-2012 at 07:51..
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Old 10-10-2012, 09:09   #32
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Originally Posted by DannyR View Post
I do not wish them to fail, but am only curious if they really are an improvement. No more, no less.

There are three variables that may cause brass to the face:

1. Firearm
2. Operator
3. Ammo

1. Yes it is definitely my Gen 4 G19
2. Never an issue the past 14 years and 7 other Glocks including a 2nd and 3rd Generation G19
3. Ammo does play a role in my gun which I verified in my testing. Lower power Factor and possibly even the rim of the case make a difference in how often the erratic ejection occurred.

4. The Extractor and spring. Which Randy explains in the link I posted earlier. Just changing the Extractor alone turned my BTTF from once a magazine to 0/1020 rounds of testing. And the erratic ejection was reduced to an occasional case over my head instead of straight up, 3/6/9/12 o'clock and everywhere in between.
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Old 10-10-2012, 09:26   #33
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So when 1,2,& 3 have been the same on a pistol from round number 1, why would the brass to the face start after 2K + rounds through the pistol?

Well, F_M, normally I'd be glad to tell ya; but the last time I posted an opinion on this some cyberspace jerk came along and - from out 'a the blue - accused me of stealing ideas from other board members!

Now that I know I'm being monitored by the Glock Talk, 'Thought Police' I have to be a lot more careful about what I post! I will, however, give you a clue. (Ready?) It's not the ammunition; and it's not the operator, either. OK!
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Old 10-10-2012, 09:35   #34
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Well, F_M, normally I'd be glad to tell ya; but the last time I posted an opinion on this some cyberspace jerk came along and - from out 'a the blue - accused me of stealing ideas from other board members!

Now that I know I'm being monitored by the Glock Talk, 'Thought Police' I have to be a lot more careful about what I post! I will, however, give you a clue. (Ready?) It's not the ammunition; and it's not the operator, either. OK!
It was more of a rhetorical question......

I agree, it's not the ammo or operator........
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Old 10-10-2012, 09:42   #35
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Well, F_M, normally I'd be glad to tell ya; but the last time I posted an opinion on this some cyberspace jerk came along and - from out 'a the blue - accused me of stealing ideas from other board members!

Now that I know I'm being monitored by the Glock Talk, 'Thought Police' I have to be a lot more careful about what I post! I will, however, give you a clue. (Ready?) It's not the ammunition; and it's not the operator, either. OK!
Maybe it's just me but I respect the opinions you pose and your experience.Fanboys just want to cheer their favorite guns but if a gun fails to function,I don't care who produces it it's just a expensive fishing sinker.

If a gun can't be made to work it is worthless,what you and other posters are trying to do is get to the cause of why lately Glocks are less than perfect. Sometimes it's just the gun or in this case the Glock. SJ 40
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Old 10-10-2012, 10:31   #36
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Originally Posted by Arc Angel View Post
Well, F_M, normally I'd be glad to tell ya; but the last time I posted an opinion on this some cyberspace jerk came along and - from out 'a the blue - accused me of stealing ideas from other board members!

Now that I know I'm being monitored by the Glock Talk, 'Thought Police' I have to be a lot more careful about what I post! I will, however, give you a clue. (Ready?) It's not the ammunition; and it's not the operator, either. OK!
Well, if I should ever come up with an idea, please feel free to do with it as you will.
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Old 10-10-2012, 10:34   #37
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I haven't caught you making a mistake yet, either, SJ!




NOTE: Sometimes, being brutally frank about a gun (or any other product) and how well, or not, it performs is a social obligation we owe to one another.)
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Old 10-10-2012, 11:40   #38
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I haven't caught you making a mistake yet, either, SJ!




NOTE: Sometimes, being brutally frank about a gun (or any other product) and how well, or not, it performs is a social obligation we owe to one another.)
I think the same way, what I know I can deal with but Pie in the Sky B S is just that,Pie in the Sky BS. SJ 40
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Old 10-10-2012, 11:51   #39
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Originally Posted by Glock2336 View Post
Some are at M4Carbine.net where their members had first dibs...
http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=87993


DannyR, you seem like you want them to fail and are in denial of the brass to the face problem.
Yes it seems Danny has been in denial. I am not trying to call you out Danny but as much as you shoot can you post a resent video of you shooting any of your gen 4 9mm. I would like to check out the ejection. I had a gen4 23 and had no issues at all before I sold it for my OD 19. But I do believe experienced shooters are having BTF issues.
To me it's not that big a deal as my guns are range guns. I rather have a gun that shoots every time with BTF than one that goes click.
I feel for those that use theirs for work (Leo's) and have to deal with the BTF issue.
I hope a solution will come up soon. (Apex or otherwise)
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Old 10-10-2012, 15:21   #40
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Just saw this too...
http://www.thegunzone.com/glock/gloc...rs_report.html

What now, Gaston?

Harry Schneider reports on a curious issue with his favorite pistol

The Glock Model 19 is my preferred go-to handgun and I shoot it more than do most people.

I have personally experienced several failures to eject with my late 3rd Generation Glock 19, including several inline stovepipes including "Reverse Inline Stovepipes." The accompanying images depict three of more than twenty ejection failures with this gun (out of several thousand rounds) - note that these three photos involve three different brands of ammo).

I replaced the extractor assembly and recoil spring assembly and the problems continued with various magazines and types of ammo. I blamed myself because 9 X 19mm Glock pistols have a long established reputation for extraordinary reliability. The malfunctions most often occurred when I was shooting very rapidly. I have had tendonitis and suspected limp wristing.

Eventually this topic came up on the Gunsite Alumni list and I learned that many other well-trained shooters were experiencing the same problems with late "3rd Gen" 9 X 19mm Glocks and "4th Gen" 9 X 19mm Glocks. The reliability problems follow no predictable pattern sometimes showing up initially and sometimes after several thousand rounds.

It seems that Glock .40 S&W pistols have had ongoing issues, especially when insults are added such as when the shooter adds a flashlight and does not replace the magazines or at least the magazine spring every three years and does not replace older weaker recoil springs.

(When magazines are left continuously loaded, the springs should be replaced as part of routine maintenance.)
Glock has been making subtle changes in "3rd gen" guns to make the .40 more S&W pistols more reliable but at the same time the reliability of the 9 X 19mm pistols apparently has suffered as a result of these subtle changes.

White Sound Defense High Reliability Extractor Depressor A Gunsite Alumni list member stated that a solution is the White Sound Defense High Reliability Extractor Depressor (H.R.E.D.) plunger assembly for Glock pistols chambered in 9 X 19mm.

I got mine about a month ago and despite my best efforts I have not been able to make the pistol malfunction since. I have emptied 15- and 33-round magazines as quickly as I can, sometimes intentionally limp wristing. I have tried different ammunition ranging from +P+{sic} to weak "Wal-Mart white box."

(I have not tried Remington because their "UNC-brand practice ammo1" is so inferior that it is not a fair test for anything expect testing the shooters malfunction drills.)
I have obviously not tested the White Sound Defense 9 X 19mm product long term, nor have I tested their 357 SIG/.40 S&W variant.

However, thus far I could not be more pleased and would not dream of carrying my Glock Model 19 without the White Sound Defense assembly inside. I normally discourage aftermarket parts for Glocks, but wanted to share my experience with others even before my customary lengthy trial period.

Once again I am 100% comfortable with my Glock Model 19. Input is welcome.
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Old 10-10-2012, 15:46   #41
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I have no means of making a video. Perhaps someone can video me at Masaad Ayoob's school in SC next month. I'll be using a Gen4 G19 there.
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Old 10-10-2012, 16:52   #42
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I have no means of making a video. Perhaps someone can video me at Masaad Ayoob's school in SC next month. I'll be using a Gen4 G19 there.
That would be great if someone could. Once again I mean no disrespect and I am not calling you out.
Even in a good shooter like Hickcok45s gen 4 vids you can see brass bounce off his hat. He is not having any failures but the brass is still ejecting funny. Just curious to see your ejection and if it stays consistant. You may no be getting BTF but I wounder if any of yours are weak. Hope this makes sense
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Old 10-10-2012, 17:09   #43
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So where are all the range reports for the new Apex extractor?
Here is mine:

G19 FDE Gen3, build Apr 2012, 336 ejector & dipped MIM extractor
1st 450 rds - 12-15 brass-to-face, 1 stovepipe & erratic weak ejection in 360 degree arc.

I switched to the 30274 ejector & Lone Wolf extractor. I fired 300 rds more rds. There was an improvement, but not ”Perfection.” No Brass-to-face, no stovepipes, 95% of the ejection 3-5 o’clock, slightly stronger ejection (2-3ft away instead of at my feet). However, I had 5 landed on top of my head & several on my right arm.

Last weekend, I tried the Apex extractor & spring along with the 30274 ejector. I fired 250 rds. I had no BTF & no malfunctions. Ejection was 4-5 o'clock landing 3-5 ft away. I had one case graze my right shoulder.

I have several other Glocks including a G19 Gen2 & a 2005 G19 Gen3. None have the problem with BTF using same ammo & shooter (me).
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