[randr1979]

Originally Posted by mad.gunsmith

well how cheep will depend on the open market
I will say that for a new glock $450 up to $600 no where near the $1000
no permit like we do in Texas unless you want to carry
CHL is $250 for 4 years
and when we get constitutional carry $0.00

i could live with that. especially that CHL fee and 4 year schedule.


TX got it good.

[randr1979]

Originally Posted by jimbullet

Make the PTC too expensive and it will be seen as for the rich only. You dont want it to be too cheap as well that everyone will just want to have one for the sake of it

i agree with jim, people rarely value things which are freely given away.

As for the high cost of licensing and issuance of permits making it seem elitist, it might do that but then again the FEO/FED is not in the business of creating an egalitarian society.

Let's face it, legal gun owners are in fact a select group already anyway and I don't see anything wrong with that. It takes a certain kind of character to freely decide to carry the privilege, burden, and responsibility of being armed in polite society. Guns are for some.

[g300d]

Originally Posted by randr1979

Why I am okay with guns and ammo being expensive.


Going through Cabelas and Brownells I can't help but notice that we Filipinos (minimum wage $1.33/hr) pay two to three times the price people in the USA (minimum wage $7.25/hr) pay for their guns and ammo. Add to that an average of P5,500.00 for licensing, tax and bond, etc. and you are easily paying more than two times what a person in the USA would pay to legally acquire a similar firearm.

I am ok with this.

I am not rich, I barely make ends meet on most days but I understand why having firearms priced high and also requiring rather huge fees for licensing and the granting of carry permits are a good thing.

Drug testing proves nothing, it just says (assuming proper reagents are actually used on the test) you did not have drugs on your system at the time you took the test. Methamphetamine clears up in 48 hours, Marijuana maybe three or four times that duration. Neuro psychiatric evaluations (if actually administered to the applicant) prove next to nothing, it just assures the government that the gun is not going to be handed over to an imbecile (some might debate this).

What are we left with? Cost. The high price of guns and ammo gives a certain level of assurance to society at large that only those who have given it considerable thought will actually go through with their intention to purchase a firearm. Even a relatively rich person will think more than once about spending P45,000.00 to buy a Glock, possibly even more for higher priced brands. Having guns in the hands of people who think about their actions first is more than likely a good thing.

If guns could be had cheaply and on impulse I would expect the rate of hotheaded people shooting at other people would go up, especially in over crowded places like Metro Manila.

Some gun aficionados at times complain that we are getting robbed of our hard earned pesos because of the exhorbitant prices we have to pay to continue and enjoy our passion legally. Everytime similar thoughts come to mind I just imagine the hordes of mostly uneducated and discorteous people who operate dirty diesel powered public conveyances, most of which would not be considered roadworthy if they were to be actually inspected (both the vehicle and operator) and then I imagine, what if this person could actually afford to arm himself with something more potent than a tire iron? I then gladly hand over the P3,000.00 (which is easily a third of what I make every two weeks) to the nice lady at the counter just so I can have another 30 rounds in my magazine for my rifle.

Why do you expect shooting incidents to go up with the easy availability of firearms? Does the presence of a firearm somehow make people more prone to employ lethal force for no reason? Because if people are not killing each other in droves now, what would change with the presence of a gun?

Are these hordes of unwashed masses you speak of killing each other with tire irons and other things in such alarming numbers? Why not call for a ban on tire irons and have special tire iron police who shall be the only ones allowed to carry tire irons and who shall loosen and tighten lug bolts for us so we remove that thing that causes uneducated people to attack and kill each other?

When you get angry, do you tend to want to shoot people?

If not, what makes you assume other people will do that?

If you do, you have no business advocating who should and should not be owning firearms.

Speaking of education, it looks like yours did not include the study of logic and logical fallacies. Lack of education and discourteousness does not necessarily mean that that person will now purchase firearms and use them for no good reason if they were any less expensive. It simply does not follow-Non Sequitur. If someone called for education in logic to be a requirement to own a firearm, and you were thus disqualified to own a firearm, how would you feel?

And since when was a formal education necessary to determine a self defense situation?

[isuzu]

Only the rich can own guns? That's plain and simple discrimination!

The real question is this: is the individual responsible and fit to own a firearm?

[DocBob]

Originally Posted by g300d

Why do you expect shooting incidents to go up with the easy availability of firearms? Does the presence of a firearm somehow make people more prone to employ lethal force for no reason? Because if people are not killing each other in droves now, what would change with the presence of a gun?

Are these hordes of unwashed masses you speak of killing each other with tire irons and other things in such alarming numbers? Why not call for a ban on tire irons and have special tire iron police who shall be the only ones allowed to carry tire irons and who shall loosen and tighten lug bolts for us so we remove that thing that causes uneducated people to attack and kill each other?

When you get angry, do you tend to want to shoot people?

If not, what makes you assume other people will do that?

If you do, you have no business advocating who should and should not be owning firearms.

Speaking of education, it looks like yours did not include the study of logic and logical fallacies. Lack of education and discourteousness does not necessarily mean that that person will now purchase firearms and use them for no good reason if they were any less expensive. It simply does not follow-Non Sequitur. If someone called for education in logic to be a requirement to own a firearm, and you were thus disqualified to own a firearm, how would you feel?

And since when was a formal education necessary to determine a self defense situation?

[DocBob]

Originally Posted by isuzu

Only the rich can own guns? That's plain and simple discrimination!

The real question is this: is the individual responsible and fit to own a firearm?

I agree. I believe a man's capacity to pay is never a good measure of that man's responsibility, principles or integrity!

[DocBob]

Originally Posted by isuzu

Only the rich can own guns? That's plain and simple discrimination!

The real question is this: is the individual responsible and fit to own a firearm?

Sorry, double-posted!

[PMMA97]

Originally Posted by DocBob

I agree. I believe a man's capacity to pay is never a good measure of that man's responsibility, principles or integrity!

[LexaDoig]

wow this thread is still alive? sorry randr but your logic is so flawed. i won't bother to try to change your mind because you seem to be completely sold on this idea. i just wanna say that people like you are dangerous. i hope you don't end up in government

[jimbullet]

Originally Posted by isuzu

Only the rich can own guns? That's plain and simple discrimination!

The real question is this: is the individual responsible and fit to own a firearm?

This nails it. This is where all these checkings and requirements should revolve around. Determining the suitability of a person to own one.

[jprj]

Does this have something to do why you cant buy gun using a credit card?

[randr1979]

u mad bro?

[DA_NINJA]

Are you telling us that You can't buy a gun using a credit card there in the Phil, why,does anybody know the logic behind this?

[horge]

Originally Posted by randr1979

u mad bro?

You started this thread, aware that people might react in
either agreement or disagreement. I personally think your
ideas here are just wrong, but I've allowed the thread to
survive because it has elicited intelligent responses. Your
post above doesn't clear the bar, and suggests you are
simply trolling/baiting.

You've got my attention, now...
and that's not a good thing for you.

Thread locked.