GlockTalk.com
Home Forums Classifieds Blogs Today's Posts Search Social Groups



  
SIGN-UP
Notices

Glock Talk
Welcome To The Glock Talk Forums.

 
  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-01-2012, 17:37   #1
SpoiledBySig
Senior Member
 
SpoiledBySig's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Port St. Lucie, FL
Posts: 1,929
Patrol video camera for DUI's?

Been looking for decent patrol video cameras for DUI's. State Attorney's Office is starting to refuse prosecuting DUI's without video of DUI Roadside sobriety Testing/Tasks on video.

I looked into the Hero Go Pro cameras, but I have been told it's got a fisheye lens and they are terrible at night (no real idea myself, just been told that).

There's got to be something to put or use in a Patrol Car, or two, that doesn't cost so much, considering today's technology?

Very small department. About 40 sworn officers. Any suggestions of where to start looking would be appreciated.
__________________
That's my story...and i'm stickin' to it!!!
SpoiledBySig is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 17:44   #2
blueiron
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 13,602
Get loaners of whatever system you are looking at and try them out for 30 days.

What works for one agency may be completely wrong for another agency.

A rural Sheriff's office or Highway Patrol needs a lower F/stop lens than does NYPD, LAPD, or an agency with lots of ambient lighting.
blueiron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 17:49   #3
SpoiledBySig
Senior Member
 
SpoiledBySig's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Port St. Lucie, FL
Posts: 1,929
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueiron View Post
Get loaners of whatever system you are looking at and try them out for 30 days.

What works for one agency may be completely wrong for another agency.

A rural Sheriff's office or Highway Patrol needs a lower F/stop lens than does NYPD, LAPD, or an agency with lots of ambient lighting.
Very good suggestion. Very much appreciated.
__________________
That's my story...and i'm stickin' to it!!!
SpoiledBySig is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 17:51   #4
blueiron
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 13,602
Keep in mind a wide angle lens is almost mandated for capturing a wide scene. A wide angle lens is commonly mis-categorized as a fish eye lens and they are dissimilar.

A fish-eye lens is rarely used in anything except photographing interiors and by savvy realtors trying to make a room look much larger in photos. They have a distorted field of view and usually require aftermarket software to make images make sense to human eyes. This can cause problems with uninformed prosecutors, defense attorneys, and jurors.
blueiron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 17:53   #5
RocPO
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Stacked up on your door
Posts: 903
Typical of lawyers. I'd love to see where the law states that it's required to be on camera. If they weren't so terrified of stepping into courtrooms, the system would work better.

[/rant off]

Are you looking more for in car cameras, or body worn? We use a panasonic system which works well for in car. I'll try to get the name of the cameras tonight for you.
RocPO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 18:01   #6
collim1
Shower Time!
 
collim1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 10,461
We have been using Digital Ally for 5 years now. They can be downloaded by the officers at the sally port or a supervisor can use a key to swap memory sticks, so your agency can choose how they want to handle that.

I get a full week out of a memory stick and haven't had a single DUI case get lost yet. Used to happen all the time when we had Digital Patrollers.

They also have user adjustable zoom and focus and also a day/night mode depending on the lighting in your area.

My only complaint is the body mic is huge and the battery life fades dramatically with age.
collim1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 18:01   #7
SpoiledBySig
Senior Member
 
SpoiledBySig's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Port St. Lucie, FL
Posts: 1,929
Quote:
Originally Posted by RocPO View Post
Typical of lawyers. I'd love to see where the law states that it's required to be on camera. If they weren't so terrified of stepping into courtrooms, the system would work better.

There is no Law (in Florida) that says you have to have a roadside sobriety tasks/tests video. But, if State Attorney's are hesitant in taking the case...then I guess it's time to give them what they want.


Are you looking more for in car cameras, or body worn? We use a panasonic system which works well for in car. I'll try to get the name of the cameras tonight for you.

Sure do appreciate the effort(s). If a body worn camera can have enough lighting for a night time roadside sobriety test...it would do fine I reckon'.




I was just looking at this one, wondering if the lighting/position/angle would be good enough.

http://www.chiefsupply.com/4161-Veho...ng-Camera.aspx
__________________
That's my story...and i'm stickin' to it!!!

Last edited by SpoiledBySig; 10-01-2012 at 18:03..
SpoiledBySig is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 18:03   #8
SpoiledBySig
Senior Member
 
SpoiledBySig's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Port St. Lucie, FL
Posts: 1,929
Quote:
Originally Posted by collim1 View Post
We have been using Digital Ally for 5 years now. They can be downloaded by the officers at the sally port or a supervisor can use a key to swap memory sticks, so your agency can choose how they want to handle that.

I'll take a hard look at that one too. Thanks.
__________________
That's my story...and i'm stickin' to it!!!
SpoiledBySig is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 18:07   #9
blueiron
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 13,602
Look at this site and the introduction section. The original photo shows an uncorrected picture taken with a fisheye lens. If you roll your cursor over the photo, the software application is applied to the photo and it corrects the image so that it makes sense to the human eye and perception.

http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/fisheye-hemi.htm

After seeing this, you can see how a defense attorney could argue 'altered evidence' if a true fisheye lens were used on a still or video image. A wide angle lens will show as a normal wide image, similar to a person's binocular vision.
blueiron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 18:11   #10
collim1
Shower Time!
 
collim1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 10,461
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpoiledBySig View Post
I was just looking at this one, wondering if the lighting/position/angle would be good enough.

http://www.chiefsupply.com/4161-Veho...ng-Camera.aspx
The Muvi's are great and can save your butt in a pinch when out of view of your car camera, but I would not want to watch an entire battery of FST's on them, it would make me nauseous.

We had a bike officer make a DUI using one and it was hard to watch like it was filmed on a boat in rough seas.
collim1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 18:16   #11
SpoiledBySig
Senior Member
 
SpoiledBySig's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Port St. Lucie, FL
Posts: 1,929
Quote:
Originally Posted by collim1 View Post
The Muvi's are great and can save your butt in a pinch when out of view of your car camera, but I would not want to watch an entire battery of FST's on them, it would make me nauseous.

We had a bike officer make a DUI using one and it was hard to watch like it was filmed on a boat in rough seas.

That sort of eliminates the Digital Ally body camera on their site that I was just looking at (it was impressive, but you have a good point regarding constant body movement driving everybody crazy during a Roadside Sobriety test). The Digital Ally still cameras (rear view mirror one and the other one) really do impress me. Now I have to make a call and see their pricing (a $200.00 dollars off coupon already tells me it's definitely over a grand).
__________________
That's my story...and i'm stickin' to it!!!
SpoiledBySig is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 18:17   #12
ryanm
Senior Member
 
ryanm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Central Arkansas
Posts: 4,044
Our state police uses the Digital Ally system. They work but the officers don't like them as well as the old VHS.
I've got one user with the Patrol Witness PWLite. It seems like a solid system.
http://www.lonestarpse.com/patrol-wi...ra-system.html
http://www.patrolwitness.com/applications/police/

My department has a couple of the 10-8 video systems. They work, but I really don't care for them. They seem about half baked. Excellent recordings, though. Wires are really, really small. Tough to connect some wires without breaking them. Documentation seemed like it was a bit lacking.
http://www.10-8video.com/
__________________
DaBigBR: OMG Iz B-ing ROBD LOLZ Send popo plz thx!
"Accu-Wedge. I'm suddenly shaplier" -Tous, 10/22/08
I wear a badge. He wears a tracking anklet. Applications are on the table.
ryanm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 18:18   #13
SpoiledBySig
Senior Member
 
SpoiledBySig's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Port St. Lucie, FL
Posts: 1,929
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueiron View Post
Look at this site and the introduction section. The original photo shows an uncorrected picture taken with a fisheye lens. If you roll your cursor over the photo, the software application is applied to the photo and it corrects the image so that it makes sense to the human eye and perception.

http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/fisheye-hemi.htm

After seeing this, you can see how a defense attorney could argue 'altered evidence' if a true fisheye lens were used on a still or video image. A wide angle lens will show as a normal wide image, similar to a person's binocular vision.
I see your point (I think?). I wouldn't even want to introduce a fixed "fisheye lens" video into court. But that site sure impressed me regarding how they fixed the fisheye images.
__________________
That's my story...and i'm stickin' to it!!!
SpoiledBySig is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 18:24   #14
SpoiledBySig
Senior Member
 
SpoiledBySig's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Port St. Lucie, FL
Posts: 1,929
Quote:
Originally Posted by ryanm View Post
Our state police uses the Digital Ally system. They work but the officers don't like them as well as the old VHS.
I've got one user with the Patrol Witness PWLite. It seems like a solid system.
http://www.lonestarpse.com/patrol-wi...ra-system.html
http://www.patrolwitness.com/applications/police/

My department has a couple of the 10-8 video systems. They work, but I really don't care for them. They seem about half baked. Excellent recordings, though. Wires are really, really small. Tough to connect some wires without breaking them. Documentation seemed like it was a bit lacking.
http://www.10-8video.com/

That Lonestarse link really impressed me (until I saw the price of the camera..like, $3000.00. At my city Department, since 1990 until I retired in 2004, we used VHS in car video systems.

I guess either we're going to have to spend some money, or take our chances on something cheap and lousy. I guess the body worn cameras are out of the picture (no pun intended).
__________________
That's my story...and i'm stickin' to it!!!
SpoiledBySig is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 18:27   #15
ryanm
Senior Member
 
ryanm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Central Arkansas
Posts: 4,044
The 10-8 systems is the least expensive "full-featured" system that I've found. And it's $1795 or so with the good mic.
I really like the PWLite system that I installed. That's what I would have in my unit if I can come up with the funds. I guess I need to sell a few more first.
__________________
DaBigBR: OMG Iz B-ing ROBD LOLZ Send popo plz thx!
"Accu-Wedge. I'm suddenly shaplier" -Tous, 10/22/08
I wear a badge. He wears a tracking anklet. Applications are on the table.
ryanm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 18:29   #16
Pete7072
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 102
We just switched to the Panasonic Arbitrator 360 Systems. They are amazingly clear. They automatically switch over to night vision, and download automatically when you're within 100 yards (? ) or so of HQ. They can be accessed through username and password from the computers inside HQ. You're also logged on to the system, from your in car computer, which helps review the stop, or incident. The mics are clear too even with traffic flying by at 60 + mph on a highway. I've had my body mic off a couple of times on MV stops, and the in car microphone has picked up everything. Amazing system. I couldn't tell you the price off hand. We used to have the Mobile Vision system. They recorded to VHS tapes. They weren't bad either, the problem is, no one had VCR's anymore. haha If you're going to get a camera system for the car, I would strongly suggest the Panasonic Arbitrator 360 system. Every PD in my area that has cameras, uses them.

Last edited by Pete7072; 10-01-2012 at 18:30..
Pete7072 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 18:29   #17
ryanm
Senior Member
 
ryanm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Central Arkansas
Posts: 4,044
It sounds like an older recycled VHS system or a Hi-8 system would be best for you right now.
__________________
DaBigBR: OMG Iz B-ing ROBD LOLZ Send popo plz thx!
"Accu-Wedge. I'm suddenly shaplier" -Tous, 10/22/08
I wear a badge. He wears a tracking anklet. Applications are on the table.
ryanm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 22:56   #18
x_out86
Senior Member
 
x_out86's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 1,207
We use WatchGuard and I have to say that I like them overall. We use the DV-1 system since the new 4RE are a bit on the expensive. The video is good, camera automatically switches from day to night view, audio quality is good and so is body mic range, and you can also record both cameras at the same time. The nicest thing IMHO is the fact that you can never really run out of tape since it has a hard drive and a DVD drive. It is constantly recording to the hard drive in the background and then starts writing to the DVD drive once you hit the lights. If you miss something, you can always use their Record After the Fact feature and retrieve any video that was recorded in the background. I would say that we usually can go back about a month or so with this feature.

I know that they do trial periods for departments and they will also sell you refurbished units at a discount price. Customer service is great with them. The few times that we have had problems with the system a quick call to them was all it took and they sent out replacement parts or a replacement unit within a day or two.

I would at least give them a call and get some prices on new and refurbished units.

http://watchguardvideo.com/dv1/overview
__________________
Hellen Keller:
I long to accomplish a great and noble tasks, but it is my chief duty to accomplish humble tasks as though they were great and noble. The world is moved along, not only by the mighty shoves of its heroes, but also by the aggregate of the tiny pushes of each honest worker.

Last edited by x_out86; 10-01-2012 at 22:57..
x_out86 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2012, 23:11   #19
collim1
Shower Time!
 
collim1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 10,461
Wow, I didn't realize there were so many in car camera options out there. I still remember copying my 8mm tapes onto VHS for court.
collim1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2012, 01:49   #20
GumbyDammit
Xtra CoCheese
 
GumbyDammit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Not nearly close enough to Fiji
Posts: 3,807
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpoiledBySig View Post
I looked into the Hero Go Pro cameras, but I have been told it's got a fisheye lens and they are terrible at night (no real idea myself, just been told that).
My kid has a GoPro he uses for videoing his parkour adventures. Great camera and excellent quality. They also have a case with a lens that gets rid of the fisheye.

That said, they aren't designed or well suited for what you are trying to do. I'd go with the guys suggesting a refurb VHS unit or something. We still have several old models in use and they work fine.

Also, don't forget about the possibility of getting a fed grant to pay for them if your city is tight. I don't know what's available, but I'm sure there are some on here who could point you in the right direction.
__________________
The other night there was a loud argument in the hall outside my apartment while I was trying to sleep. I went out and told them they better leave or I was gonna use some Kung-Fu... THAT scared them off...

Plus I was totally nekkid and holding a gun.

Last edited by GumbyDammit; 10-02-2012 at 01:49..
GumbyDammit is offline   Reply With Quote

 
  
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:33.




Homepage
FAQ
Forums
Calendar
Advertise
Gallery
GT Wiki
GT Blogs
Social Groups
Classifieds


Users Currently Online: 560
113 Members
447 Guests

Most users ever online: 2,672
Aug 11, 2014 at 2:31