License plate readers: A useful tool for police comes with privacy concerns

4Rules · 09-08-2012, 09:04

With virtually no public debate, police agencies have begun storing the information from the cameras, building databases that document the travels of millions of vehicles.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/license-plate-readers-a-useful-tool-for-police-comes-with-privacy-concerns/2011/11/18/gIQAuEApcN_story.html

4Rules · 09-08-2012, 09:06

"We used a license reader in order to identify the longitude and latitude to identify the area we believed she might be in," Fossa said.
Cellphones emit the longitude and latitude of their location so Officer Paul McNamara used the Automated License Plate Reader to narrow down the location, he said.
"As such, we were able to locate a young woman from Fitchburg who had traveled from her home," Fossa said. "It's a great story about technology, really."

http://www.sentinelandenterprise.com/local/ci_21479735/tech-gear-helps-police-find-distraught-woman

***Sam Spade*** · 09-08-2012, 09:56

What privacy expectation do you have in public acts with a state-issued placard?

You want a real story, delve into *private* use of this same technology.

***TBO*** · 09-16-2012, 12:43

ModGlock17 · 09-18-2012, 17:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Rules

With virtually no public debate, police agencies have begun storing the information from the cameras, building databases that document the travels of millions of vehicles.

Here's a hint for ya. Watching surveillance video is the most boring thing on earth. Sometimes, I think that's what happens when you go to Hell. The Devil makes you watch surveillance video of an intersection.

We only look at them when there's troubles.

SgtScott31 · 09-21-2012, 04:48

Our ALR does not store tag numbers. It has helped locate stolen vehicles and vehicles associated with bad crimes or runaways. I think Facebook is capturing more information about your personal life than anything a license plate reader is going to do. It posts where you have been, places that you're likely to go to, and a multitude of things that I care not do divulge; hence why I disable most of the options on it.

eracer · 09-21-2012, 06:08

Someone can see my license plate?

glockout · 09-24-2012, 10:41

I nearly always hold a finger up when I see a traffic cam.

Brucev · 09-25-2012, 20:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by SgtScott31

Our ALR does not store tag numbers. It has helped locate stolen vehicles and vehicles associated with bad crimes or runaways. I think Facebook is capturing more information about your personal life than anything a license plate reader is going to do. It posts where you have been, places that you're likely to go to, and a multitude of things that I care not do divulge; hence why I disable most of the options on it.

You are correct about facebook capturing information. And one can disable the options to suit ones own preferences. Unfortunately one cannot exercise such choice with regard to the recording, etc. of license plate information indicating locations observed, etc.

There is no reason why the police should be able to surveil law abiding citizens going about their daily activities. That sort of thing is done in old europe and england. That sort of thing is done in n. korea and other such communist countries. But, that sort of thing has absolutely no place in a free society. It has no place at all in America.

***TBO*** · 09-25-2012, 21:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by glockout

I nearly always hold a finger up when I see a traffic cam.

They're not recording you on your bicycle.

CitizenOfDreams · 09-25-2012, 22:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam Spade

You want a real story, delve into *private* use of this same technology.

What's the worst a private company can do to me? Show me a personalized ad banner based on my travel routes?

Foxtrotx1 · 09-25-2012, 22:48

well, driving is a privilege not a right. If you don't want your plate read don't drive.

CitizenOfDreams · 09-26-2012, 08:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Foxtrotx1

well, driving is a privilege not a right. If you don't want your plate read don't drive.

So, freedom of travel in general is a right, yet traveling by any specific means (car, bus, subway, airplane...) is a privilege?

Are the rest of the "freedoms" in the Constitution the same way?

***TBO*** · 09-26-2012, 09:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by CitizenOfDreams

So, freedom of travel in general is a right, yet traveling by any specific means (car, bus, subway, airplane...) is a privilege?

Are the rest of the "freedoms" in the Constitution the same way?

Driver's License, issued by the state.
Vehicle License plate, issued by the state.
Roads/Streets/Highways, built by government.

All regulated by the state.

Don't like it? Build your own roads/highways and do as you like.

Otherwise, drum your feet all you like, as you have no leg to stand on.

Sent from the toe of my jack boot using Tapatalk 2

Armchair Commando · 09-26-2012, 09:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by TBO

Driver's License, issued by the state.
Vehicle License plate, issued by the state.
Roads/Streets/Highways, built by government.

All regulated by the state.

Don't like it? Build your own roads/highways and do as you like.

Otherwise, drum your feet all you like, as you have no leg to stand on.

Sent from the toe of my jack boot using Tapatalk 2

You should write built by tax payers, Government didn't build anything, tax payers money did.

Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine

SgtScott31 · 09-28-2012, 18:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brucev

You are correct about facebook capturing information. And one can disable the options to suit ones own preferences. Unfortunately one cannot exercise such choice with regard to the recording, etc. of license plate information indicating locations observed, etc.

There is no reason why the police should be able to surveil law abiding citizens going about their daily activities. That sort of thing is done in old europe and england. That sort of thing is done in n. korea and other such communist countries. But, that sort of thing has absolutely no place in a free society. It has no place at all in America.

It's no different than a LEO running your tag while he's traveling behind you or driving by your vehicle parked in a lot. It's a license plate on a public road (or in a public area). There's absolutely no expectation of privacy.

***TBO*** · 09-29-2012, 22:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by SgtScott31

It's no different than a LEO running your tag while he's traveling behind you or driving by your vehicle parked in a lot. It's a license plate on a public road (or in a public area). There's absolutely no expectation of privacy.

CitizenOfDreams · 09-30-2012, 12:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by SgtScott31

It's no different than a LEO running your tag while he's traveling behind you or driving by your vehicle parked in a lot.

So you see no difference between checking tags and tracking?

Would you mind wearing a GPS ankle bracelet every time you leave your house? It's no different than a cop seeing you on the street, according to your logic.[/QUOTE]

***TBO*** · 10-01-2012, 20:37

SgtScott31 · 10-19-2012, 03:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by CitizenOfDreams

So you see no difference between checking tags and tracking?

Would you mind wearing a GPS ankle bracelet every time you leave your house? It's no different than a cop seeing you on the street, according to your logic.

[/QUOTE]

There's obviously a difference between checking tags and tracking. Although conducting surveillance and following someone around does not require a warrant either. As the officers doing the following are going anywhere anyone else in public can go. There are no black helicopters overhead. It's simply a tool that will identify tags associated with crimes/missing persons.

cowboywannabe · 10-19-2012, 03:59

no reasonable expectation of privacy in the public view, so whats the hub bub?

Aux Bear · 10-19-2012, 05:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by CitizenOfDreams

So you see no difference between checking tags and tracking?

Would you mind wearing a GPS ankle bracelet every time you leave your house? It's no different than a cop seeing you on the street, according to your logic.

[/QUOTE]

Was at the AT&T store the other day. They wanted me to upgrade to a GPS enabled phone. That way they could activate it at their will and find me IF they ever "needed" too! So, ankle tags aren't needed for the majority of people. We already carry a GPS signal for anyone with the technology to track. (Even if they are turned off - on the newest phones I was told. Part of a phone "Theft Recovery" program.)

glockbanger · 10-23-2012, 22:46

I've got a few concerns of my own about this topic.

1)Does anyone know what involved in putting a "flag" on your plate so that it cannot be ran by civilians? Is there a fee for doing so?

2)Is there anything that you can legally put over your plate to protect it from being scanned by plate readers? or simply to obscure it from view?

3)For a civilian running a plate.. how large are the fees and do you contact the DMV or county clerks? Also, how lengthy are the forms and what reasons do you typically need to run a plate?

glockbanger · 10-23-2012, 22:51

Is a flag always an option, or is a special reason required?

rockapede · 10-25-2012, 07:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheStreetKing

You should write built by tax payers, Government didn't build anything, tax payers money did.

Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine

True. Those same taxpayers elected representatives that passed laws requiring licensing vehicles for use on public roadways. Those licenses are also, by laws enacted by elected representatives, required to be in public view. What, exactly, is your point?