GlockTalk.com
Home Forums Classifieds Blogs Today's Posts Search Social Groups



  
SIGN-UP
Notices

Glock Talk
Welcome To The Glock Talk Forums.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-19-2012, 18:59   #26
jp3975
Senior Member
 
jp3975's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Texarkana, Tx
Posts: 6,378
Quote:
Originally Posted by socialwork911 View Post
american workers is the issue..and our $$$ don't go back to fund army's against the usa....buy what you want..i'm not here to convince you
Last time I checked UAE is an ally.
jp3975 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 19:18   #27
checkyoursix
Senior Member
 
checkyoursix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: behind you
Posts: 800
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by jp3975 View Post
...According to this guy it is.

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/201...-vs-caracal-c/

Trying to sell my Steyr to get an F model.
Your conclusion is not really representative of the conclusions of the article though. The article has many a praise for the Caracal, but the conclusions are towards the Glock for two very fundamental reasons: the sights were inadequate in the dark and the gun doesn't have any reliability record. Here is an expert:

Quote:
So would I pick the Caracal for my EDC? Probably not. There are two issues that lead me away from the Cat.
I usually donít use black targets for range reports because they donít photograph well, but thatís what I had for my first date with the Caracal. Shooting at black B24s, I discovered immediately that a black gun aimed at a black target using black sights in dim light is a recipe for failure. It was just too hard to get the gun on target with the QAS.
Since most confrontations occur at night, and most home invaders donít wear brightly colored Hawaiian shirts with white trousers, Iím thinking that the sights might be a problem in the real world. Still, thatís nothing that canít be fixed with a new front sight (all thatís needed). RF will modify and report.
The real issue for me: the plastic Arab lacks the Glockís record of reliability. Even though TTAGís testers have thrown well over a thousand rounds of God-knows-what downrange with the Caracal C with only a single bum bullet, Iíd only consider the C for my Every Day Carry (EDC) after the gunís reliability and durability were proven through some kind of torture test. Or a longer track record.
__________________
The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always sure of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.

Bertrand Russell
checkyoursix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 19:24   #28
MrVvrroomm
Senior Member
 
MrVvrroomm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Shakopee, MN USA
Posts: 3,282
I own both Caracal C & F. I have put a LOT of rounds through both of them. I'm a Caracal fan.

The Glock 19 is a better gun, period.
__________________
May I assume you're not here to inquire about the alcohol or the tobacco?

Certified Glock Armorer
MrVvrroomm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 19:40   #29
socialwork911
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by jp3975 View Post
Last time I checked UAE is an ally.
i haven't heard them stand up against attacks...one arab country to another...too much oil involved maybe
__________________
NRA Member
socialwork911 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 19:42   #30
jp3975
Senior Member
 
jp3975's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Texarkana, Tx
Posts: 6,378
Quote:
Originally Posted by checkyoursix View Post
Your conclusion is not really representative of the conclusions of the article though. The article has many a praise for the Caracal, but the conclusions are towards the Glock for two very fundamental reasons: the sights were inadequate in the dark and the gun doesn't have any reliability record. Here is an expert:
You must have missed this line:

Quote:
Meanwhile, is the C better than the Glock 19? Yes. Yes it is.
That was the last line of the article before specs.

The issues he mentioned he admitted where minor. For starters they where in reference to the unusual quick sights which few people get. So that is a non-issue.

Reliability has also been well proven. By the German Govt as well as posters here who have put several thousand rounds through theirs in a day.
jp3975 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 19:44   #31
jp3975
Senior Member
 
jp3975's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Texarkana, Tx
Posts: 6,378
Quote:
Originally Posted by socialwork911 View Post
i haven't heard them stand up against attacks...one arab country to another...too much oil involved maybe
I havent heard YOU stand up against the KKK. Therefore you must be racist.

Saying you havent heard them stand up against terrorism is a very weak argument.
jp3975 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 19:51   #32
s&wfan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 624
All of the plastic guns are roughly equal in terms of quality of build, reliability, and durability. You basically have HK and then below them you have everyone else.

I buy M&P to support an American company, but Sig, GLOCK, Beretta, and HK all provide American jobs.

I would not have a problem with buying a gun made in UAE. HK sold guns to our enemies during the early days of the war in either Afghanistan or Iraq, don't see people boycotting them.

Gun companies exist to sell guns. If Beretta and Armalite want to have guns made in Turkey, Springfield wants to have guns build in the Philippenes(sp?), Brazil, and Croatia... Just buy the best gun you can find.

I don't like M&P only because they are made in the USA. I buy them because all of the German/Austrian guns kicking Smith's butt made them R&D their tails off, which resulted in one hell of a pistol. Granting US companies your dollar without expecting them to earn it does no one any favor.
s&wfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 05:16   #33
checkyoursix
Senior Member
 
checkyoursix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: behind you
Posts: 800
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by jp3975 View Post
You must have missed this line:



That was the last line of the article before specs.

The issues he mentioned he admitted where minor. For starters they where in reference to the unusual quick sights which few people get. So that is a non-issue.

Reliability has also been well proven. By the German Govt as well as posters here who have put several thousand rounds through theirs in a day.
You do have a point for sure, but so have I since the author also says he wouldn't choose it as an EDC. I am not entirely sure the sights are a minor issue, in my experience sights make a world of difference when it comes to hit fast or miss fast.

As for the reliability I am sure it will be fine, the designer is a first class individual and the gun felt well made when I shot it.
__________________
The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always sure of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.

Bertrand Russell

Last edited by checkyoursix; 09-20-2012 at 05:17..
checkyoursix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 09:30   #34
ZO6Vettever
Senior Member
 
ZO6Vettever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 360
I understand the frames are made from glue and ground camel hoofs. It must be true, I read it on line!
__________________
Sent from my rotary phone.

Remember, we're all on the same side!

Army Vet Dec 1965 - Dec 1971
ZO6Vettever is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 09:50   #35
M&P15T
Beard One
 
M&P15T's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Arlington, VA.
Posts: 9,122
Quote:
Originally Posted by checkyoursix View Post
Your conclusion is not really representative of the conclusions of the article though. The article has many a praise for the Caracal, but the conclusions are towards the Glock for two very fundamental reasons: the sights were inadequate in the dark and the gun doesn't have any reliability record. Here is an expert:
The sights can be changed, so that's no issue at all.

What IS an issue, and a major one, is that current 9MM GLOCK pistols are crap.....complete and utter crap.

I have owned 13 GLOCK pistols, and would not buy a current 9MM GLOCK at this point.
__________________
Lucius Quinctius Cincinnatus (519 BC Ė 430 BC) Power should only be given to those that want it least.
M&P15T is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 10:12   #36
jbglock
Senior Member
 
jbglock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 467
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rustin View Post
I can't stand the way that guy writes...

Any way I am eager to try out a Caracal. If it shoots better then I will switch over. After about 2k rounds through 3 different 9mm Glocks (19,26, then 17) I still shoot high and left. I'm thinking there might be a better polymer option out there for me. I can shoot one ragged hole all day with a 1911 but that is to be expected with the best trigger out there.
It's you. I can do that with a good 1911 or a Glock.

What exactly is the country of origin for the Caracal? I mean is it a terrorist friendly country?
jbglock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 10:43   #37
plouffedaddy
Senior Member
 
plouffedaddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Carolina
Posts: 2,194
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbglock View Post
It's you. I can do that with a good 1911 or a Glock.

What exactly is the country of origin for the Caracal? I mean is it a terrorist friendly country?

Caracal's are produced in Germany and the UAE. Imported by Caracal USA (some have been imported by Waffen Werks and Davidsons) in Alabama.
__________________
Plouffedaddy's Youtube Channel
Certified Glock Armorer
plouffedaddy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 11:44   #38
jbglock
Senior Member
 
jbglock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 467
What little reading I just did leads me to believe that UAE is an ally in the fight against terrorism. Am I missing something?
jbglock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 12:39   #39
DaBurna
Senior Member
 
DaBurna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Bama Boy
Posts: 1,890
Quote:
Originally Posted by plouffedaddy View Post
Caracal's are produced in Germany and the UAE. Imported by Caracal USA (some have been imported by Waffen Werks and Davidsons) in Alabama.

Nah Plouff.... Vaffen (W's are V's in German) Verks is in K'ville, TN

SAI (Stey'rs Importer) here in Trussville, AL is the newest importer... Both of my pistols came from Bud's and were of the Waffen Werks Variety...
__________________
To Soar as Eagles We Must Rid Ourselves of The "Barnyard Mentality"
Glock 23 Best Glock # 4 # All-Around
-GSSF MEMBER- 10 Glocks & Counting....
DaBurna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 12:48   #40
douggmc
Senior Member
 
douggmc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 1,651
Quote:
Originally Posted by jp3975 View Post
I havent heard YOU stand up against the KKK. Therefore you must be racist.
Well ... He is a racist. At least according to his first post. Making decisions based on someone's / a group's ethnicity leaves no other explanation.

Replace the word "Arab" with "White/Caucasian" and read his post out loud to yourself.

Last edited by douggmc; 09-20-2012 at 12:51..
douggmc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 12:50   #41
G36's Rule
Senior Member
 
G36's Rule's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spring, TX.
Posts: 14,879
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beretta92guy View Post
no offense sir, but who do you think you are supporting when you fill up with gasoline????
USA
Canada
Mexico

Arab nations are way down the list on US imports.

Anyway, I handled a Caracal at the last gun show. While not bad feeling it was more than a G19 and I don't know what spare mags cost.
G36's Rule is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 12:59   #42
jp3975
Senior Member
 
jp3975's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Texarkana, Tx
Posts: 6,378
Quote:
Originally Posted by checkyoursix View Post
You do have a point for sure, but so have I since the author also says he wouldn't choose it as an EDC. I am not entirely sure the sights are a minor issue, in my experience sights make a world of difference when it comes to hit fast or miss fast.

As for the reliability I am sure it will be fine, the designer is a first class individual and the gun felt well made when I shot it.
But his reasoning was silly. It was like he was looking for something negative to say about the gun. Everything was "omg its great" until asked if he would carry it. And he still said at the end that barring sites and unproven reliability[which is a joke], its a better gun.

1. No one gets quick sites...which is what the guy had on his example. The standard sites are similar to every other gun out there. The Caracal point shoots much better than the glock in his test either way. I dont imagine that if you have to shoot someone in a hurry, that you'll be using your sites.

2. Even you admit reliability is a non-issue with the Caracal.

Last edited by jp3975; 09-20-2012 at 13:03..
jp3975 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 13:32   #43
Tiro Fijo
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 5,043
Quote:
Originally Posted by M&P15T View Post
The sights can be changed, so that's no issue at all.

What IS an issue, and a major one, is that current 9MM GLOCK pistols are crap.....complete and utter crap.

I have owned 13 GLOCK pistols, and would not buy a current 9MM GLOCK at this point.

There is NO aftermarket rear sight for the Caracal which is moronically part of the rear cover plate. No night sights.

There are THREE roll pins that must be removed to clean the striker channel in the Caracal. WAY too complicated. Yes, I have shot one and the grip angle is funky for me.


My two Gen4 9mm's function perfectly. Then again, I know how to shoot and don't use Walmart ammo.
Tiro Fijo is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 14:21   #44
socialwork911
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by douggmc View Post
Well ... He is a racist. At least according to his first post. Making decisions based on someone's / a group's ethnicity leaves no other explanation.

Replace the word "Arab" with "White/Caucasian" and read his post out loud to yourself.
I am not racist....I just choose to buy USA when I can..and choose not to buy from arab countries-i've seen first hand, they do not like americans, and really never want to buy our goods...you can support this country or what ever country you're from in your own way

I served in the ***** for this country and was there the day of 911 in nyc serving....I don't know if did...but I would never call you un-american..so hold your ***** about racist, until you know me or anyone. even though, thanks to me and others, you have still the freedom to do so.
__________________
NRA Member
socialwork911 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 15:03   #45
Chesafreak
Senior Member
 
Chesafreak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Chesapeake, VA
Posts: 1,626
Quote:
Originally Posted by checkyoursix View Post
Your conclusion is not really representative of the conclusions of the article though. The article has many a praise for the Caracal, but the conclusions are towards the Glock for two very fundamental reasons: the sights were inadequate in the dark and the gun doesn't have any reliability record. Here is an expert:
Caracal offers a fiber optic front site option. I think others have already addressed the reliability. (German testing)
The Caracal has been adopted for the armed forces by Abu Dhabi, Bahrain, Dubai, Jordan, and the UAE.
Chesafreak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 15:04   #46
Chesafreak
Senior Member
 
Chesafreak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Chesapeake, VA
Posts: 1,626
Here's something you may find interesting:

Quote:
The slide to frame fit is very nice for a polymer-framed pistol, which I believe has to do with the long frame rails. The total frame rail length on a Glock is 1.58 inches according to my calipers. The rail length on the Caracal F is a whopping 6.8 inches. This is more than a 430 percent increase over the Glock, and is mostly likely responsible for the improved slide/frame fit on the Caracal. Both slide-to-frame fit and barrel fit are tighter on the Caracal than the average Glock.

Read more: http://www.handgunsmag.com/2012/04/2...#ixzz272vHOgtj
Chesafreak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 16:47   #47
plouffedaddy
Senior Member
 
plouffedaddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Carolina
Posts: 2,194
Quote:
Originally Posted by G36's Rule View Post
USA
Canada
Mexico

Arab nations are way down the list on US imports.

Anyway, I handled a Caracal at the last gun show. While not bad feeling it was more than a G19 and I don't know what spare mags cost.
$30 online.
__________________
Plouffedaddy's Youtube Channel
Certified Glock Armorer
plouffedaddy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 17:01   #48
packinaglock
John 3:16 <><
 
packinaglock's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Loxahatchee Fl
Posts: 4,597
Quote:
Originally Posted by socialwork911 View Post
I am not racist....I just choose to buy USA when I can..and choose not to buy from arab countries-i've seen first hand, they do not like americans, and really never want to buy our goods...you can support this country or what ever country you're from in your own way

I served in the ***** for this country and was there the day of 911 in nyc serving....I don't know if did...but I would never call you un-american..so hold your ***** about racist, until you know me or anyone. even though, thanks to me and others, you have still the freedom to do so.
I don't see myself buying one either.
__________________
A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
packinaglock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 18:21   #49
Comedian
Senior Member
 
Comedian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 922
The trigger on the Caracal C is no doubt better than any Glock. I sold my G19 to fund my Caracal C. I was surprised at how accurate the C was. They are both excellent pistols, but i overall prefer the Caracal. I am waiting on night sight options for the Caracal's though. As soon as the night sights are available, i will start carrying the C.
__________________
Glock 19 RTF2
Glock 17 Gen 4
S&W M&P 9mm
Comedian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 18:23   #50
Comedian
Senior Member
 
Comedian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 922
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrVvrroomm View Post
I own both Caracal C & F. I have put a LOT of rounds through both of them. I'm a Caracal fan.

The Glock 19 is a better gun, period.
In what areas do you find Glock to be better? Just curious. Obviously sight options and aftermarket support is an advantage for Glock.
__________________
Glock 19 RTF2
Glock 17 Gen 4
S&W M&P 9mm
Comedian is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:17.



Homepage
FAQ
Forums
Calendar
Advertise
Gallery
GT Wiki
GT Blogs
Social Groups
Classifieds


Users Currently Online: 713
182 Members
531 Guests

Most users ever online: 2,244
Nov 11, 2013 at 11:42