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Old 07-08-2012, 22:02   #21
pck50
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Wow now thats some cartridges I do miss as also the GECO BAT TRAUMA, But in all honesty a good current decent replacement today would be the HORNADY Critical Duty
9mm 135 grain +P No Hirtenberger and no GECO BAT TRAUMA But far better then what maybe currently available.



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Originally Posted by Merkavaboy View Post
If you want an increased pressure 9mm load try finding some Hirtenberger L7A1 124FMJ ammo. This is definately a high, but not overpressure, loading from 1990/91. I've shot 50 rnds of this ammo out of my G19 with no signs of overpressure and it chrono'ed at 1279fps for a 5-shot avg.
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Old 07-09-2012, 03:26   #22
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hmm....never mind lol but is she really alive? Technically maybe. That's pretty ****ed up though.
Technically? She is doing fine. Almost 100 percent.

You should do some reading on how well the 9mm FMJ does for the US military.
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Old 07-09-2012, 07:31   #23
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I have to ask the OP, how much penetration are you after? Also are you assuming that on the slight chance you get a tumble it is somehow better than consistant expansion and penetration?
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Old 07-09-2012, 08:51   #24
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Originally Posted by Foxtrotx1 View Post
Before choosing 9mm FMJ, you should consider that Rep. Giffords is still alive partially due to their lack of lethality.

Was she incapped the time of the shooting though?

And are you certain a slightly bigger bullet would have changed things? Wasn't there a kid that took a speer gun to the head with little damage (relatively speaking) to his brain, and is expected to make an almost full recovery?....
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Old 07-09-2012, 11:30   #25
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I have to ask the OP, how much penetration are you after? Also are you assuming that on the slight chance you get a tumble it is somehow better than consistant expansion and penetration?
I just don't like hollow points, and I really just started this thread looking for some ammo. I don't want to go into it that much. I like my 9mm FMJ. I'd prefer, however, a Winchester Model 70 in a 30-06. Something like that I'd switch to a flat nose or soft point but I just don't like hollow points.

To each his own
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Old 07-09-2012, 11:44   #26
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Originally Posted by Foxtrotx1 View Post
Technically? She is doing fine. Almost 100 percent.

You should do some reading on how well the 9mm FMJ does for the US military.
Did some more reading on her. That's crazy how well she is doing after that kind of wound. That guy did kill a lot of other people though, including a 9 year old girl. I don't really like using this incident to judge the effectiveness of a cartridge. It's kinda ****ed up.

R.I.P. Christina Green

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Old 07-09-2012, 13:00   #27
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I still trying to look into the "low recoil" powder. I don't really know about that. I'd imagine it'd be a slower burning powder, which I wouldn't like.
Well, you're not going to get a fast projectile without using a slower burning powder. No free lunch, amigo.

As far as recoil, it totally depends on the load. I use some fast powder / heavy for caliber bullet combos that recoil fairly light - seems to be the popular combo in gun games. I also have tried Unique and WSF side by side and found the WSF load to be much smoother.
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Old 07-09-2012, 13:01   #28
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Did some more reading on her. That's crazy how well she is doing after that kind of wound. That guy did kill a lot of other people though, including a 9 year old girl. I don't really like using this incident to judge the effectiveness of a cartridge. It's kinda ****ed up.

R.I.P. Christina Green
There is nothing wrong with taking a positive out of a terrible event.

Like the medical knowledge we gained from the Nazis experiments in ww2. It would be a waste and shame if we didn't use it for good.
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Old 07-09-2012, 13:02   #29
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I just don't like hollow points, and I really just started this thread looking for some ammo. I don't want to go into it that much. I like my 9mm FMJ. I'd prefer, however, a Winchester Model 70 in a 30-06. Something like that I'd switch to a flat nose or soft point but I just don't like hollow points.

To each his own
Well your distaste in hollow points could get someone hurt. A 9mm fmj is going a long way on a miss.
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Old 07-09-2012, 13:03   #30
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I like the underwood ammo. I don't really like HP ammunition though. I like FMJ with a 9mm so I keep my tumble effect/penetration.
This is kind of a BS though. Whether the bullet tumbles or not is in the design, not the vel. So all a faster FMJ gets you is it leaves the target sooner. Not much point in FMJ IMO, just poking less than caliber holes, UNLESS it hits bone or tumbles & there is just no guarantee either will happen. BTW, if the bullet does tumble, penetration is reduced drastically in any caliber. Damage goes up, but penetration goes down.
Reality, most RNFMJ will veer or deflect & not tumble & that comes at the end as the bullet slows. That loss of straight line penetration could mean a miss on vitals instead of a hit. The Gifford shooting is such an anectdotal event. A properly built JHP will straight line penetrate & cause a much larger perm wound channel leading to faster incapacitation. Think about it, one reason FMJ is banned for hunting in almost all states & is only prefered in Africa for thick skinned, large boned DG.
Yes, to each his own, but for most of us, FMJ is a handicap & you are already handicapped having to use a handgun for SD. Why make it worse, especially since your thought about penetration & tumbling are really counter to each other.
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Old 07-09-2012, 13:05   #31
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This is kind of a BS though. Whether the bullet tumbles or not is in the design, not the vel. So all faster FMJ gets you is it leaves the target sooner. Not much point in FMJ IMO, just poking less than caliber holes, UNLESS it hits bone or tumbles & there is just no guarantee either will happen. BTW, if the bullet does tumble, penetration is reduced drastically in any caliber. Damage goes up, but penetration goes down.
Listen to Fred, hes a very informed member here.

Worst case:
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Old 07-09-2012, 16:16   #32
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This is getting too heated for me!! EJECT!! EJECT!!! EJECT!!!!

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Old 07-09-2012, 16:17   #33
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Why not just go with a FMJ .357 Sig or a FMJ .38 super?

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