[bac1023]

Originally Posted by glock2740

Does this mean that Colt will actually be able to repair the timing issues of some of the older Pythons? If not, then they are opening up a box of **** that will really stink. And they better hope that the "new" Python's don't have any issues. I appreciate Colt trying to make a come back, from the damn near grave, but their new 1911's haven't impressed me in the least bit. The real Pythons were built by true craftsmen.

Yeah, I don't even want to see a new Python. There is no way Colt could possibly to the name justice with what they have to work with today.

You know damn well all the smiths that used to work on and build them are long gone.

[dnuggett]

Originally Posted by bac1023

You know damn well all the smiths that used to work on and build them are long gone.

That is true, but there are smiths at Colt working on the old ones right now. Are they messing the old ones up? I honestly don't know, but I'd like to see where they are if they are.

[countrygun]

Originally Posted by bac1023

Yeah, I don't even want to see a new Python. There is no way Colt could possibly to the name justice with what they have to work with today.

You know damn well all the smiths that used to work on and build them are long gone.

You have to give up. Chances are that 90% of the people clamoring for a "New" Python don't even know that most serious collectors consider there were at least 3 generations, and quality levels, of the "Old" Python.
Put a vent rib on something and stamp "Python" on it, most of them have never handled a "classic" Python anyway. The name is good enough,

[pizza]

Originally Posted by glock2740

When did Colt say they they were re-releasing the Python? News to me. I'm fine with the two I already have.

Sweet...I love the 4 inch python. Just like Davis and the bad cops used in Magnum Force...LOL!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[hogship]

Originally Posted by dnuggett

That is true, but there are smiths at Colt working on the old ones right now. Are they messing the old ones up? I honestly don't know, but I'd like to see where they are if they are.

Sort of what I was thinking, too!

I'd be willing to bet we still do have some gunsmiths that are every bit as good as the old guys.......and, they would drool over the chance to put a thousand new Pythons together! (Of course, I'm talking about the best of the best revolver smiths........not just anyone who calls himself a gunsmith!)

This is a chance for Colt to break back into the market that is "owned" by Smith now-a-days. It's also a chance to take the old weaker Colt lock work and toughen it up a bit.

If they produced a top notch improved Python, it would open the doors to doing the same with.........say, a Detective Special!.

If Colt did this idea up right......I'd be willing to bet they could compete in today's market.......with today's market prices!

ooc

[hogship]

Now, just pipe dreaming here...........

I'd be willing to bet Colt could produce a new Python every bit as smooth as the older Pythons, by simply improving the action with modern sealed miniature roller bearings.......

.......and, they could probably duplicate the old Python action with far less labor time, to boot!

There is no question that modern CNC equipment will reduce labor time, and improve tolerance specifications in all the machining processes.

ooc

[glock2740]

Originally Posted by pizza

Sweet...I love the 4 inch python. Just like Davis and the bad cops used in Magnum Force...LOL!

Was actually a movie that made me fall in love with the blued 4" Python when I was a kid. Also, a 7.5" Ruger RH .44 Magnum was my very first handgun. Not a Model 29, like Dirty Harry carried, but it was stainless and just as good to me.

[CDR_Glock]

I don't think they'd have an Msrp for less than $2500.

[Sgt127]

They could keep the price down a little by offering only stainless with a vapor honed finish or something. The old Royal blue and nickel would be too labor intensive.

Lots of CNC machines, internals cut with an EDM machine or something to reduce all the hand fitting.

Rubber grips instead of wood.

IF they come out with the Python again, I think they could get it on the market for a retail price of $1600 and you could buy them for around $1300.

We'll see. If they can't clone the original (quality wise) I wish they wouldn't bother.

[WiskyT]

Originally Posted by MarcDW

I would wait for the product to make such a statement.
With the CNC you could get quite nice fitting.
Also, the SIG P210 is a legend older then the Python (I think!?) and SIG Sauer now makes them again.
Does not hurt the legend one bit.

Exactly. CNC and other advances make the most expensive part of the Python, the skilled labor, cheap. People ignore this and think the only way to make a gun like that is to have some guy named Henry who has been with Colt since the 1930's delicately assembling it.

Take engines for example. The engine in my Mustang has variable cam timing, 4 valve DOHC heads, computer controlled fuel injection, meets emission standards and gets 30MPG and makes over 300 BHP. The technology in that engine is stuff that cost F1 teams a hundred grand not long ago and my whole car cost $22,000.00.

Whether Colt will make it, and what it would be marketed for, I have no idea. Colt has gone out of their way to run it's self into the ground for the last few decades and I have no idea if they are getting any smarter or not. Supposedly they are a "New Colt" and are getting back on track.

[45caldan]

Originally Posted by hogship

Now, just pipe dreaming here...........

I'd be willing to bet Colt could produce a new Python every bit as smooth as the older Pythons, by simply improving the action with modern sealed miniature roller bearings.......

.......and, they could probably duplicate the old Python action with far less labor time, to boot!

There is no question that modern CNC equipment will reduce labor time, and improve tolerance specifications in all the machining processes.

ooc

While CNC maching would make it cheaper and easier to "produce" a Python, it won't make it "better".
The Python was all about laborious hand fitting, polishing and deep blueing. It would be extremely expensive to give one the same level of fit and finish today....
I agree with BAC that the old ones would continue to rise in value do to this....same as the new "Classic" Smiths vs. the older ones....who the hell wants a "Classic" M27 with a freaking lock hole on the side.

[WiskyT]

Originally Posted by hogship

If they produced a top notch improved Python, it would open the doors to doing the same with.........say, a Detective Special!.

If Colt did this idea up right......I'd be willing to bet they could compete in today's market.......with today's market prices!

ooc

Armscor alrady makes the DS for about $180.00. It aint purdy, but it works. For a couple of hundred more they could easily make it polished and everything the DS was back in the day.

[glock2740]

Is there any official news or link of this from Colt?

[glocksterr]

Originally Posted by glock2740

The real Pythons were built by true craftsmen.

does that mean they didnt eat chop suey?

[38 Super Fan]

Originally Posted by bac1023

Yeah, I don't even want to see a new Python. There is no way Colt could possibly to the name justice with what they have to work with today.

You know damn well all the smiths that used to work on and build them are long gone.

I agree completely. I wasn't even real impressed with the Python Elites I've handled, I hope they're not seriously bringing back the Python again.

[Salmoneye]

Originally Posted by bac1023

Frankly, I don't want it to happen.

It won't.

[Berto]

They could do like S&W and apply the name to a friggin polymer pistol.

[AngryPanda]

I'm with BAC. A modern Python stands a good chance of blemishing the Python name. It wouldn't be a stretch to imagine an internal lock, a rollmark about how you should read the owners manual, etc. If they do come out for around a grand, that will be very telling. I'd rather get a beat up, but fixable old model for a grand than a modern one. That said, I have not seen what they will produce, and I question if they even will produce a new Python. Maybe it will be a fine firearm. Knowing Colt (todays Colt) They will make about 10% of the demand and charge twice what they ought to cost.

[countrygun]

Originally Posted by WiskyT

Exactly. CNC and other advances make the most expensive part of the Python, the skilled labor, cheap. People ignore this and think the only way to make a gun like that is to have some guy named Henry who has been with Colt since the 1930's delicately assembling it.

Take engines for example. The engine in my Mustang has variable cam timing, 4 valve DOHC heads, computer controlled fuel injection, meets emission standards and gets 30MPG and makes over 300 BHP. The technology in that engine is stuff that cost F1 teams a hundred grand not long ago and my whole car cost $22,000.00.

Whether Colt will make it, and what it would be marketed for, I have no idea. Colt has gone out of their way to run it's self into the ground for the last few decades and I have no idea if they are getting any smarter or not. Supposedly they are a "New Colt" and are getting back on track.

A Colt Python isn't a car. What you are describing is more like Ruger's improvements to the Colt SAA. Yet, despite the improvements Ruger has made while keeping the same recognizable form Colt has no trouble with their re introduction of the SAA.

For the sake of the computer generation, the original Python cannot be duplicated by merely putting the right command lines in a program. They were the result of a "balamce" between the, actually few, springs, and the meshing of the other parts. The modern methods can produce very nice guns alright, but we haven't replaced the human hand and it's ability to evaluate pressure or gauge smoothness. Colt had made moves in that direction with the last "generation" of the "Old" Pythons. Dig real deep into the reviews and you will find the difference between those later Pythons, and the ones with the craftsman's initials stamped in them, was noticable.

[Berto]

I'm not completely sold on the whole majic juju craftsmanship of the early Python vs new. IMO much of that is attributed to newer harder steels, esp going from carbon to SS. The same with newer S&W vs old.
A gun can be crafted with modern steel alloys and CAD/CAM methods with all the handfitting and polishing utilized on the classic era Pythons and people will still insist it's an abomination on some level because it does't have some intangible feel juju of an older gun with softer parts worn in to perfect harmony.

[WiskyT]

Originally Posted by Berto

I'm not completely sold on the whole majic juju craftsmanship of the early Python vs new. IMO much of that is attributed to newer harder steels, esp going from carbon to SS. The same with newer S&W vs old.
A gun can be crafted with modern steel alloys and CAD/CAM methods with all the handfitting and polishing utilized on the classic era Pythons and people will still insist it's an abomination on some level because it does't have some intangible feel juju of an older gun with softer parts worn in to perfect harmony.

Yup. The idea that modern manufacturing can't be as good as old manufacturing is nonsense. There was nothing magical about old Pythons. They were very well made, well finished, beautiful guns. Guns like that get made every day. The fact that a CNC machine could do the majority of the work, and then a skilled person finish it, shouldn't be some kind of mystery.

The Python could easily be made, and to the previous standards, if Colt, or anyone else wanted to. We put a man on the Moon over 40 years ago, we make 305hp economy cars, but somehow, the ability to make a simple gun made of steel will elude Mankind for eternity

[countrygun]

Originally Posted by WiskyT

Yup. The idea that modern manufacturing can't be as good as old manufacturing is nonsense. There was nothing magical about old Pythons. They were very well made, well finished, beautiful guns. Guns like that get made every day. The fact that a CNC machine could do the majority of the work, and then a skilled person finish it, shouldn't be some kind of mystery.

The Python could easily be made, and to the previous standards, if Colt, or anyone else wanted to. We put a man on the Moon over 40 years ago, we make 305hp economy cars, but somehow, the ability to make a simple gun made of steel will elude Mankind for eternity

With our modern knowledge of chemistry we should be able to make whiskey without aging it too

BTW as someone who has worked on a whole lot of revolvers made from the 1930's to two years ago, case hardening carbon steel does make for a potentially smoother surface than any stainless steel can acheive on it's own.

There is a 'Ju-ju" to crafting and tuning the Colt action.

Sorry if that infers that modern man and his computers are less than the complete masters of the world.

[Sgt127]

This is the inside of a couple year old Smith Model 629. Great finish. Well machined...



This is the inside of an old Smith....



Specifically, a 1936 Smith & Wesson Registered Magnum. Nicely done, but, nothing like the new version.

Anything today CAN be made as well, or better than it was made years ago. Is it worth the time and energy? Usually not. A very usable product can be manufactured for alot less money. But...if somebody wants to....

25 years ago, I had Wilson build me a Master Grade 130 .45. I sent them a brand new Series 70 Colt. And eight hundred dollars later, I got back one of the finest hand fitted .45's imaginable. Hand checkered. Slide to frame fitted. Macth barrel etc. But, all those parts, with all thier built in tolerences, had to be fitted, by hand.

Now, you can buy an off the shelf gun with those same tolerences because all the parts can be built to within a thousands of an inch, exactly, everytime.

[WiskyT]

Originally Posted by Sgt127

This is the inside of a couple year old Smith Model 629. Great finish. Well machined...



This is the inside of an old Smith....



Specifically, a 1936 Smith & Wesson Registered Magnum. Nicely done, but, nothing like the new version.

Anything today CAN be made as well, or better than it was made years ago. Is it worth the time and energy? Usually not. A very usable product can be manufactured for alot less money. But...if somebody wants to....

25 years ago, I had Wilson build me a Master Grade 130 .45. I sent them a brand new Series 70 Colt. And eight hundred dollars later, I got back one of the finest hand fitted .45's imaginable. Hand checkered. Slide to frame fitted. Macth barrel etc. But, all those parts, with all thier built in tolerences, had to be fitted, by hand.

Now, you can buy an off the shelf gun with those same tolerences because all the parts can be built to within a thousands of an inch, exactly, everytime.

No!No! The guy that finished your 1911 is gone and unless someone clones him, and I mean quick, your gun could never be made again

Guys talk about guns like they are some kind of fine wine. Heck, even the wine guys are full of crap half the time.

[dnuggett]

Originally Posted by glock2740

Is there any official news or link of this from Colt?

No.


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