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Old 04-12-2012, 14:26   #201
Warp
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RussP View Post
His new lawyer, a well known Orlando defense atty.

In general terms the automatic pass is a pretrial evidentiary challenge by the defense where the prosecutor must show they have adequate evidence to eliminate self-defense as a defense.

It is being discussed in multiple media and legal venues. Google it...stop being pissy with all these questions that have been answered and discussed before.
I do not recall reading anything about the specific phrase automatic pass
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Last edited by Warp; 04-12-2012 at 14:29..
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Old 04-12-2012, 14:28   #202
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Edit: Automatic pass.

I searched this volume and volume I. I don't see any mention of an "automatic pass" until just now.

Am I missing something?
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Old 04-12-2012, 14:29   #203
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That I am certain will not happen. The liability portion of the homeowners' insurance is there to protect the homeowner if they do something that creates a liability for them. A special assessment by the HOA for something other than that particular homeowner's individual liability will not be an "insured risk"
It really depends upon how the HOA is structured and the individual's ins. policy.
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Old 04-12-2012, 14:31   #204
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Unfortunately, it is against the rules.

Thanks for letting me know now, instead of me doing it and getting an infraction.
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Old 04-12-2012, 14:45   #205
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Warp View Post
I do not recall reading anything about the specific phrase "free pass".

I am not watching the news. I basically never watch the news.

I'm sorry you don't like people asking questions.
Do you read the threads here on GT about this case?
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Originally Posted by msu_grad_121 View Post
It's an interesting theory for sure, and may not be outside the realm of possibility. It occurred to me today while listening to a former FL prosecutor that this whole dog-and-pony show may be for naught on one major thing: the Stand Your Ground law.

This guy was saying that prior to the actual trial, they'll have a SYG hearing, and if he's exonnerated, Zimmerman cannot be charged with ANY crime related to the shooting (at least in FL, federal is obviously a different thing). Not knowing the actual ins-and-outs of how it works in FL, this whole thing might be the SA's way of appeasing everyone. The race monger jerks get their wish and he's arrested and charged, and Zimmerman gets to walk based on the fact that if/when he's found to be protected under SYG, the murder charge gets dismissed. She can say she did her best, and everyone is (at least somewhat) satisfied.

DISCLAIMER: The above post does not necessarily reflect actual reality, merely the reality that exists inside my head, where things are more often than not over-thought and needlessly complex.
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Originally Posted by Cav View Post
I wondered about this issue, and then found this;
Quote:
George Zimmerman can ask to have the second-degree-murder charge against him dropped without having to stand trial in the death of Trayvon Martin.

Two years ago, the Florida Supreme Court ruled that anyone claiming "stand your ground" immunity in a death, battery or assault case can request a hearing on the evidence.
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Originally Posted by kensteele View Post
Nope don't worry about it. Plenty of criminals have gone to jail because of their criminal actions and the rest of us continue with our lives. Zman made a mistake and you'll see if he plea bargain (if offered which is no guarantee depending on the evidence which is unlikely).

Zman's last hope is to try to get a judge to dismiss his charges. I'm almost sure there will be a SYG hearing. Too bad this may affect the FL laws if it goes badly. Sadly FL residents would put everything on the line on a case they really don't know the facts about.
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Originally Posted by hyperstyx View Post
Read Gutmacher's blog that addresses the post-arrest, pre-trial evidentiary hearing in which defendant must, by preponderance of evidence, prove lawful self-defense action. Failure here results in the case proceeding to trial.

I submitted a Q on the site regarding maintenance of civil immunity under circumstance of trial and NOT GUILTY verdict. I'll advise if answered...then ask about the effect Supremacy Clause/Fed Preemption could have on Fl statutes if they proceed with criminal or civil action.
And here is the link to Gutmacher's blog http://orlandocriminallawyer.blogspo...blogspot.com/2
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Old 04-12-2012, 14:50   #206
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Originally Posted by RussP View Post
Do you read the threads here on GT about this case?
And here is the link to Gutmacher's blog http://orlandocriminallawyer.blogspo...blogspot.com/2
I've followed the volume I thread and this thread. That's all I have time for.

Nowhere in any of those quotes do I see the phrase "automatic pass". If those quotes are referring to an automatic pass hearing/situation/whatever, I had no idea.

I had never heard of [an automatic pass] before and wondered what it was.

Edit: If it's something that's been in the MSM recently I also wouldn't know that. I don't watch the MSM anymore, at all. The discussion about it/them in these threads indicates, to me, that I made a wise decision in avoiding them. I will sometimes click links that get posted but I don't sit and watch the news or go to their websites and browse.

I'd rather read a summation of the article from a few different people, usually on various forums, so I don't support the MSM website with a click and advertiser viewing money
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Old 04-12-2012, 15:18   #207
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Mark O'Mara sounds like a fairly intelligent, aggressive lawyer (from what I've read). Just wondering if he is representing Zimmerman Pro Bono?

Anyone??
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Old 04-12-2012, 15:24   #208
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Originally Posted by bear62 View Post
Mark O'Mara sounds like a fairly intelligent, aggressive lawyer (from what I've read). Just wondering if he is representing Zimmerman Pro Bono?

Anyone??
I've seen it reported in several places that he is indeed representing him Pro Bono.
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Old 04-12-2012, 15:28   #209
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WOW.

You guys didn't take ANY easter break, did you?
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Old 04-12-2012, 15:54   #210
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http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/20...on-martin?lite

Probable cause affidavit - Zimmerman pursued and provoked a confrontation before shooting Martin.

Judge found probable cause to pursue the case based on the affidavit...

Last edited by rahrah12; 04-12-2012 at 15:55..
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Old 04-12-2012, 16:15   #211
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Originally Posted by rahrah12 View Post
http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/20...on-martin?lite

Probable cause affidavit - Zimmerman pursued and provoked a confrontation before shooting Martin.

Judge found probable cause to pursue the case based on the affidavit...
The affidavit certainly doesn't match up with Zimmerman's story ........ but then I guess we knew it wouldn't.....
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Old 04-12-2012, 16:40   #212
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kat1950 View Post
The stand your ground came into play when ask Do you Have a problem with Me, That is a threat, Zimmerman held his ground and said no.


All you people are worrying about your Stand your Ground laws and are trying to divert attention away from law so as to try and save it. Its gone, it coming, here in Florida. Now just get rid of CCW. Only an idiot straps a gun on every day.
I guess you have never been a victim of a violent crime. I have and looking down the wrong end of a .38 Special for 4 hours until SWAT showed-up and shot the perpetrator is not a situation I will encounter again without my gun, if allowed. Perhaps if you were in my situation, you would have felt differently? (I carry a gun because I am allowed to, and a cop is way too heavy.). And, yes, I do not go most places that do not allow me to have my gun. Peace.

Now back to the thread....
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Last edited by whenmonkeysfly; 04-13-2012 at 16:21.. Reason: Clarification
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Old 04-12-2012, 16:54   #213
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I can't stand Al Sharpton, but was laying down and didn't see the remote nearby, and he was on.

Interesting discussion on his show (which surprised me)... 3 "experts" (2 of which would actually qualify) discussing this case. 1 stated there was a slight chance SYG would result in the case being tossed by the judge. Another, cited a case with some similarities that was in FL in the last 2 weeks, that was dismissed by a judge due to SYG.

A guy's house was broken into, he hears them rummaging around, he gets up, grabs a knife, and the thief runs out before he can confront him in the house. The guy leaves his house, and goes to search for the guy. He finally catches up to him, tells him to stop. The thief swings a bag of radios he had at the guy, the guy blocks it, and stabs the thief in the chest. Thief dies in the street.

The guy then DOES NOT call the police, but picks up the radios and pawns them off the next day. The police finally get on his trail 3 days later, he confesses, and is arrested. At the SYG hearing (which the guy on TV, basically said is like a mini trial in front of the judge), the judge tossed the murder charge.

Not exactly the same of course, but there are some distinct similarities to that case, and the Zimmerman case.

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Old 04-12-2012, 16:57   #214
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Originally Posted by IndyGunFreak View Post
I can't stand Al Sharpton, but was laying down and didn't see the remote nearby, and he was on.

Interesting discussion on his show (which surprised me)... 3 "experts" (2 of which would actually qualify) discussing this case. 1 stated there was a slight chance SYG would result in the case being tossed by the judge. Another, cited a case with some similarities that was in FL in the last 2 weeks, that was dismissed by a judge due to SYG.

A guy's house was broken into, he hears them rummaging around, he gets up, grabs a knife, and the thief runs out before he can confront him in the house. The guy leaves his house, and goes to search for the guy. He finally catches up to him, tells him to stop. The thief swings a bag of radios he had at the guy, the guy blocks it, and stabs the thief in the chest. Thief dies in the street.

The guy then DOES NOT call the police, but picks up the radios and pawns them off the next day. The police finally get on his trail 3 days later, he confesses, and is arrested. At the SYG hearing (which the guy on TV, basically said is like a mini trial in front of the judge), the judge tossed the murder charge.

Not exactly the same of course, but there are some distinct similarities to that case, and the Zimmerman case.

IGF

Do you have any names or links for the cases? Would like to read up on them...
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Old 04-12-2012, 17:32   #215
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Originally Posted by c6601a View Post
M...and did not identify himself as part of the neighborhood watch on the 911 calls can be used to show that he did what he did in his private capacity.
repeated phone calls to 911 and the non-emergency number plus the rapport he had with the department can easily establish his "official" capacity. i simply don't think it is possible for zman to effectively claim he was acting purely in a private capacity from what i have heard so far and doesn't even take into account the information that we are not privy to. just listen to the way he provides descriptions, listen to way he handles the request to meet with officers, he begins the conversation with "we've had multiple break-ins" and he follows which the reasonable person would not do. individually these don't mean much but in totality they paint a pretty clear picture.

if needed, the state should able to convince a jury zman went from running an errand to neighborhood watch person, maybe not in a legal capacity, but he certainly conveyed that understanding and he certainly had that mindset. who knows what he told martin. if his defense is to claim he's just an average armed citizen going about his ordinary business who got attacked for no reason, he's going to lose imho.
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Old 04-12-2012, 17:42   #216
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You hear about that?

I'll let you hear one of my personal experiences. Back in August my girlfriend got into a wreck going 70 mph in a small suzuki verona, hitting a STOPPED chevy 1500 creating a 4 car pile up. She suffered a broken nose, and sprained ankle, with some cuts from the auto glass and such.

After I cleaned the blood off from her face, you couldn't even tell her nose was broken, in fact the ER didn't believe her either until they took an x-ray and confirmed she did in fact break her nose. They told us to expect her to get two black eyes, tons of swelling, etc etc from this broken nose in a day or two.


...... Three days roll around and her nose was a little swollen, but one would have to look carefully. Her nose healed before her cuts, I'd say 2-3 weeks the only injury that was left noticeable on her was her ankle, she had trouble walking for 1-2 months after such, which of course the ankle part would be irrelevant in this case.

What I'm getting at is, Zimmerman could have easily suffered these injuries, including a broken nose, and none of us would be able to tell without an x-ray..... I sure hope he has that x-ray for court.....
good to hear she came thru it ok. some people get really torn up in car accidents, others walk away with no scratches, many in between. seems to me if you are fighting murder charges claiming self-defense, you want to fall in the former category. can you agree with me that we should let the medical experts testify in an open courtroom to establish the facts rather than a small police department and a couple of paramedics in the field contributing to the final call? car accident victims don't have to atone for their injuries, that's why my comments were not serious; on the surface, looking at Zman, i'm not personally inclined to believe he just came out of a fight for his life but I understand the fears. not just that pic, but the earlier video as well....but this is all just personal perception.
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Old 04-12-2012, 17:50   #217
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rahrah12 View Post
Do you have any names or links for the cases? Would like to read up on them...
He mentioned the name on the the specific case he referred to(the burglary then stabbing).. but I didn't get the first name.. could have swore the last name he said was Garcia-something

I wish I had thought to get up and write the names of the guy down.
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Old 04-12-2012, 17:50   #218
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i simply don't think it is possible for zman to effectively claim he was acting purely in a private capacity...
The post you quoted was about a hypothetical civil case against Zimmerman and the HOA. In that situation, Zimmerman would want to claim that he was acting as an agent of the HOA so they can share the liability.

Lets keep the discussion of civil and criminal issues separate.
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Old 04-12-2012, 17:52   #219
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rahrah12 View Post
Do you have any names or links for the cases? Would like to read up on them...
http://www.drudge.com/news/155089/st...-thief-stabber

Here's a blurb on Drudge about it... that should help in tracking down more info.

http://blogs.miaminewtimes.com/ripti...our_ground.php
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Old 04-12-2012, 18:04   #220
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The affidavit certainly doesn't match up with Zimmerman's story ........ but then I guess we knew it wouldn't.....
Those that want to defend Zimmerman are looking only at his statements and accepting them as the undisputed truth. They are then selectively looking at other evidence to bolster their chosen position.

It is interesting that the affidavit completely contradicts one "fact" that many here had used to bolster the case for Zimmerman: The shell casing was found on the ground and not still in the chamber due to a failure to cycle as many here had believed.

I am absolutely certain that by the time everything comes out in court, a lot of other things accepted as facts by people on both sides of the issue will be shown to be pure fabrication.
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