Originally Posted by Andrew Wiggin
Not trying to be a jerk but HDDs are not ballistic gel and the bullets pictured aren't expanded so much as smooshed. I've seen several independent tests of XTPs into gel or water after passing through denim, drywall, sheet metal, etc. The results were less than impressive. I'd like to work up a woods load with 200gr XTP and 800X so maybe I'll do my own test. Can you fill us in on the details of the denim tests you've done?
The HD wasn't a test. It was the target for firing the first 17 rounds of my new 9mm. The ammo just happened to be what I carry and shoot in my PF-9.
And your far from being a jerk.
I again have never had any issues with XTP's concerning any media I've shot them into. I gave up on informal testing years ago. It became clear I could never duplicate what would happen to a bullet in a gun fight.
I do have access to other info that's not available to the average joe on the street or even in the know when it comes to the aftermath of a shooting. I once worked at a metro downtown hospital in my area. And still have a very close relationship with this hospital and staff. From administration to house keeping, doc's, nurse's and techs. Seeing that this is a teaching hospital they have a medical library that is always growing. And a collection of bullet's and surrounding tissue and organs that's very impressive. And have seen the damage first hand that projectiles do to the human structure. From the ER, Surgical efforts to the morgue.
Bottom line: You can't predict what a bullet is going to do in or around the human body. You can get a lab coat out, wear a pocket protector and have a farm of the most advance computers and software the world has ever seen and enough gel to render a nuke useless. And all you will get is a SPEC result.
A few examples:
A man I've known since the 5th grade. We grew up together. Learned to shoot, reload and hunted together. He did everything at a very high level. If it wasn't perfect. It was not right. He decided to kill himself one day. Should be a easy task for him. Out comes a K-Frame Smith loaded with +P .38 Gold Dots, 158gn. That round should do it. Didn't, Blew a hole the size of a silver dollar in his forehead and only scramble one square inch of his frontal lobe. One would have thought the load would have turned his brain into pink slime. First thought was it was a squib or light load. Setting right next to him was a fresh box of 50 of his reloads, plus the other 5 rounds in the pistol. The investigation showed he had a very thick forehead bone structure and that his rounds where in good shape.
Another case involves a employee of the hospital I worked at. By day he was a lead man on house keeping staff. By night he was a leader of a local Crip Click. On a Sunday evening he had been detained by the local PD. Was in cuffs standing next to the detaining officer when a Blood ran up on the pair and shot Rodney in the chest with a sawed off pistol gripped .22 mag bolt action rifle. That round blew a hole completely through his chest big enough to put your fist through him, without touching him. I saw his remains with my own eyes and read the police info in the file Monday when I came to work. Explain that with gel and common knowledge.
For me I can buy XTP's anywhere. Load them how I want and can afford to practice, plink and drill with a bullet I can use if I ever need to. I can't do that with Gold Dot's. 95% of my past, current and future loaded up ammo is SD, HD and offensively ready for action.
It's all a crap shoot!