Home Forums Classifieds Blogs Today's Posts Search Social Groups



  
SIGN-UP
Notices

Glock Talk
Welcome To The Glock Talk Forums.

 
  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-10-2011, 21:47   #21
rca256
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Colorado
Posts: 1,233
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregKJR View Post
well, by the time I have 3,000, or 6,000 or 7,000 post on GT......I may no longer be a deprimer tumbler too.
__________________
G21, G22, G23, G27, G36, SIG P228

"Hey, let's be careful out there." - Hill Street Blues (1981)
rca256 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2011, 23:36   #22
kcbrown
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 709
Quote:
Originally Posted by unclebob View Post
The way I look at it if you want a progressive press and if you want to weigh every charge a 550 or 650 is better than the LNL.The Dillon’s are a lot easier to pull the case out add the power and put the case back into the press.
There's no need to do that.

The Lee powder drop die (included in their 3 and 4 die pistol sets) comes with a small screw-in funnel that will let you drop the powder through to the case while the ram is up. It goes in place of the auto disk (Pro or otherwise) powder measure on the top of the die.

That way, you get your case mouth flaring and powder drop by hand all in one shot, and it'll work in any progressive as long as the die is sufficiently long (that's questionable on a 650. I use the Dillon powder measure so I don't know if Lee's PTX will work on it).

Last edited by kcbrown; 02-10-2011 at 23:37..
kcbrown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2011, 23:53   #23
noylj
Senior Member
 
noylj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 315
Just some passing thoughts

Read a post that said: "...The way I look at it if you want a progressive press and if you want to weigh every charge a 550 or 650 is better than the LNL.The Dillonís are a lot easier to pull the case out add the power and put the case back into the press."
I find that removing the case on the Hornady with the spring is a LOT easier than pulling a pin and removing the case. One is a one-hand job and the other is a two-hand job (and no jokes about hand jobs--we can be gentlemen, can't we?).
I found nothing superior about the 650 I used several years ago and REALLY did not like the 550B at all. This is why I don't tell someone what they should buy, but try to make sure that they aren't just drinking the blue kool-aid and have actually made an informed decision. They may, and may will, disagree with me, but I hope they at least looked into things first.
I do not advocate cleaning primer pockets, but it makes sense that it takes no more actual time to deprime with the Lee Universal Depriming die while I inspect and sort.
I can not believe people who:
1) Think that their way is the only way
2) Think that the gun actually needs loads that have been weighed to tighter tolerances than +/- 0.1gn (particularly rifle shooters).
3) Think that the only way to load is to make every case the same as the next--so they trim all their pistol cases and eliminate the few long ones that could actually have produced increased accuracy.
4) Load to the minimum recommended COL shown in the loading manuals (as though it is by divine perfection) and wonder why they are having feeding problems or case bulges.
5) Refuse to start with the starting load and want to know what bullet, powder, and charge weight they should use for their first 1000 round loading session.
6) Get all hung up on why their rounds are not all within 0.002" of the target COL, when they have never even measured their bullets to see how much they vary in length and ogive datum location.
7) Actually worry that full-length resizing that .45ACP case twice while setting-up will significantly work-harden and shorten the life of the case.
noylj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2011, 00:09   #24
Boxerglocker
Jacks #1 Fan
 
Boxerglocker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Lynnwood, WA
Posts: 6,004
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregKJR View Post
The only 2 reasons you do not deprime and tumble pistol brass are.....habit, time. Do you have to deprime then tumble to get a good performance out of your brass? No. Will your performance improve and increase the longevity of your brass if you do? Yes. Why do bench shooters do it? Because they want peak performance out of each round they load. Why should a pistol shooter deprime and tumble their brass? So every single round they load will be exactly like the previous. Take a flashlight and visually inspect 5 rounds and clean out the residue with a pick the next time you load, not every single round will be exactly the same, but all will have residue build up. I am not trying to beat a dead horse here, and many are set in your ways. I was taught what is right, and what is right for me may not be the same as the next. I do not consider myself OCD, some may disagree......but I deprime, tumble, seperate, and at a minimum hit each brass with my case prep center for a second or two. I have not been loading pistol for long with a progressive, although I have loaded many thousands with the person that taught me. I have been loading .308 for awhile on a chucker. If I am going to "teach" someone to load rifle or pistol, I am going to teach them in a way for them to get the most out of each round they load. Not meaning to step on any toes here, these are after all......just my humble opinions.

I agree with Jack's statements, well thought out reply with merit. However not realistic at all. How many rounds of pistol do you shoot a month? I go through 2000 or more... I know and compete with guys that do double that. I could not imagine the extra pointless work having any benefit. I test my load pretty regularly, my SD's in the last 4-5 santioned IDPA matches I competed in were all within 5 fps standard deviation. Precsion rifle yes I can see the importance but pistol
__________________
Glock 3rd Gen G19/G34, 4th Gen G17 FDE, G26,
Dillon
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
&
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
BLUE Kool-aid drinking team member

Last edited by Boxerglocker; 02-11-2011 at 23:32..
Boxerglocker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2011, 08:48   #25
unclebob
Senior Member
 
unclebob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Mary Esther FL
Posts: 6,968
Quote:
Originally Posted by noylj View Post
Read a post that said: "...The way I look at it if you want a progressive press and if you want to weigh every charge a 550 or 650 is better than the LNL.The Dillonís are a lot easier to pull the case out add the power and put the case back into the press."
I find that removing the case on the Hornady with the spring is a LOT easier than pulling a pin and removing the case. One is a one-hand job and the other is a two-hand job (and no jokes about hand jobs--we can be gentlemen, can't we?).
I found nothing superior about the 650 I used several years ago and REALLY did not like the 550B at all. This is why I don't tell someone what they should buy, but try to make sure that they aren't just drinking the blue kool-aid and have actually made an informed decision. They may, and may will, disagree with me, but I hope they at least looked into things first.

Letís say you want to weigh every charge on the Dillon 650 press. For one you leave the pins in station 3 and station 4 out. No two hand operation. Pull the case out of station 3 add the powder put the case back in station 4 add the bullet and seat the bullet. The case is right in front of you, no pulling pins every time. I also load normally with no pin in station 3. Have never had a case fall out on me. Where is the case on the LNL? Yes I know where it is at.
Yes I agree for the person to make an informed decision on what press they want. Just like I said before. If you look at the two pressís the Dillon to me wins in workmanship and quality. Yes there are things I like about the LNL. But I like more things about the 650. Also like I said if you want auto indexing without a case feeder get the LNL. If you want a case feeder. Get the Dillon. And if you do not care for the auto indexing get the 550.
Yes I know about the Lee and Dillon dies that you do not need to pull the case out to add the powder if you want to weigh every charge. I have both but have found at least for me it is easier to pull the case. Without having to change the tool head or have another tool head set up to do that.
May also add that I have been reloading for 50 years and have been loading on Dillon press's for over 33 years. And have loaded well over a half million rounds. So yes I do know a little about reloading and the Dillon press and how they operate.
__________________
Team Carver Custom
NRA Certified Instructor
NRA Benefactor Life Member
GSSF Life Member
___________________________________________
unclebob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2011, 08:53   #26
Colorado4Wheel
Senior Member
 
Colorado4Wheel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: CO
Posts: 14,415
Why would you even pull the case to load a charge. Just use a charge die. Lower the handle, charge the case by hand, raise the handle and do it all again.
__________________
Steve
Colorado4Wheel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2011, 09:04   #27
unclebob
Senior Member
 
unclebob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Mary Esther FL
Posts: 6,968
Quote:
Originally Posted by Colorado4Wheel View Post
Why would you even pull the case to load a charge. Just use a charge die. Lower the handle, charge the case by hand, raise the handle and do it all again.
Steve read all of what I said.
Yes I know it is easy to change out the die on the LNL. But I was talking about the 550 and 650.
__________________
Team Carver Custom
NRA Certified Instructor
NRA Benefactor Life Member
GSSF Life Member
___________________________________________

Last edited by unclebob; 02-11-2011 at 09:20..
unclebob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2011, 10:31   #28
unclebob
Senior Member
 
unclebob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Mary Esther FL
Posts: 6,968
Thanks Steve, you just gave me and idea. Will be leaving here shortly for mouse land for the Orlando GSSF match. So when I get back will have to check it out and see if it well work?
__________________
Team Carver Custom
NRA Certified Instructor
NRA Benefactor Life Member
GSSF Life Member
___________________________________________
unclebob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2011, 10:33   #29
Colorado4Wheel
Senior Member
 
Colorado4Wheel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: CO
Posts: 14,415
Maybe we just don't understand eachother. I would not pull the case on the LnL or the 650. Just use a charge die, lower the handle, charge the case, raise the handle and keep loading.

Nothing to do with changing the dies.
__________________
Steve
Colorado4Wheel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2011, 10:59   #30
unclebob
Senior Member
 
unclebob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Mary Esther FL
Posts: 6,968
Quote:
Originally Posted by Colorado4Wheel View Post
Maybe we just don't understand eachother. I would not pull the case on the LnL or the 650. Just use a charge die, lower the handle, charge the case, raise the handle and keep loading.

Nothing to do with changing the dies.
I have found that it is just as easy to pull the case at station 3 add the powder, and then put the case back at station 4. Don’t have to change anything. Did it the same way with the 550 except pulled the case at 3 and put the case back at 3.
Granted there are a lot of different ways in doing this. I have I think tried them all. But for me I think this is the easiest and fastest way of doing it. If I had a tool head set up for like doing rifle and I wanted to weight every charge then yes I would do it like you said. I was speaking more of short runs of ammo that I want to try a different powder, or for load development. We are saying the same thing but I think we are talking about different application.
Forgot to add yes I understand what you are saying.
__________________
Team Carver Custom
NRA Certified Instructor
NRA Benefactor Life Member
GSSF Life Member
___________________________________________

Last edited by unclebob; 02-11-2011 at 10:59..
unclebob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2011, 11:04   #31
.50 cal
Senior Member
 
.50 cal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 777
is it recommended to weigh each charge for a SD Hollowpoint round? should I only be reloading for cheaper range ammo and always purchase my SD rounds?
.50 cal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2011, 11:28   #32
Colorado4Wheel
Senior Member
 
Colorado4Wheel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: CO
Posts: 14,415
You only need to be weighting the max loads. Your not going to be making very many max loads in your life.
__________________
Steve
Colorado4Wheel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2011, 11:29   #33
Colorado4Wheel
Senior Member
 
Colorado4Wheel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: CO
Posts: 14,415
Quote:
Originally Posted by unclebob View Post
I have found that it is just as easy to pull the case at station 3 add the powder, and then put the case back at station 4. Donít have to change anything. Did it the same way with the 550 except pulled the case at 3 and put the case back at 3.
Granted there are a lot of different ways in doing this. I have I think tried them all. But for me I think this is the easiest and fastest way of doing it. If I had a tool head set up for like doing rifle and I wanted to weight every charge then yes I would do it like you said. I was speaking more of short runs of ammo that I want to try a different powder, or for load development. We are saying the same thing but I think we are talking about different application.
Forgot to add yes I understand what you are saying.
I get what your saying now.
__________________
Steve
Colorado4Wheel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2011, 11:36   #34
GioaJack
Conifer Jack
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Conifer, CO
Posts: 10,025
Blog Entries: 3
Quote:
Originally Posted by .50 cal View Post
is it recommended to weigh each charge for a SD Hollowpoint round? should I only be reloading for cheaper range ammo and always purchase my SD rounds?

Disregarding the potential, or non-potential legal ramifications, that subject has been argued to death, why would anyone rely on their self-admitted limited knowledge and experience to try and replicate something that is so readily available?

If you have never seeded a back yard would you start your gardening career by building a golf course? Unlikely... you'd hire a professional.

In the absence of alternatives would you pull your own impacted tooth? Again, unlikely, you'd seek the assistance of a trained dentist.

If you had no experience in operating a lathe or mill and had no mechanical engineering training would you attempt build your own gun and carry it with the expectation of relying on it in social encounters? Probably not, you'd simply go to a gun store and choose one that met your needs.

Realistically ammunition designed for serious situations is no different, no matter your individual need, (within reason) there are more than adequate choices available commercially that have been tested ad nauseam with product comparisons littering the internet.

A viable option is to learn to become a competent and knowledgeable loader which will provide you with enough inexpensive ammunition to develop and hone your skills as a shooter. One who is armed with the magical one shot, one stop bullet is useless if they can't hit the sky with a helium balloon. Practice and resulting competency is far more important than what resides in the chamber.

Buy a couple boxes of what ever SD ammunition you determine will meet your needs, fire enough of it to satisfy yourself as to functioning reliability then concentrate on loading copious amounts of training ammunition and shoot enough that all facets of the activity become second nature.

You're going to be in a lot more situations where you can make wagers with your friends and walk away with their folding money than you are being faced with a social encounter.


Jack
__________________
Life is a little bit tragic but mostly magic... Learn to deal with the tragic and CHERISH THE MAGIC

A PACIFIST is someone who won't raise their hands to defend themselves...
A COWARD is someone who won't raise their hands to defend someone else.
GioaJack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2011, 15:25   #35
Boxerglocker
Jacks #1 Fan
 
Boxerglocker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Lynnwood, WA
Posts: 6,004
__________________
Glock 3rd Gen G19/G34, 4th Gen G17 FDE, G26,
Dillon
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
&
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
BLUE Kool-aid drinking team member
Boxerglocker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2011, 18:25   #36
RustyFN
Senior Member
 
RustyFN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: West Virginia
Posts: 3,150
Quote:
Originally Posted by unclebob View Post
Thanks Steve, you just gave me and idea. Will be leaving here shortly for mouse land for the Orlando GSSF match. So when I get back will have to check it out and see if it well work?
Good luck Bob. I love shooting GSSF.
__________________
The torture never stops.
RustyFN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2011, 21:35   #37
Colorado4Wheel
Senior Member
 
Colorado4Wheel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: CO
Posts: 14,415
Quote:
Originally Posted by unclebob View Post
Thanks Steve, you just gave me and idea. Will be leaving here shortly for mouse land for the Orlando GSSF match. So when I get back will have to check it out and see if it well work?
Good luck at the match.

What idea did I give you?
__________________
Steve
Colorado4Wheel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2011, 09:21   #38
BigDog[RE]
NRA Member
 
BigDog[RE]'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Miami, FL
Posts: 1,532
I am going to chime in here and say that the more you stop the reloading rhythm to weigh your charges, the better the chance of getting a squib round or a double charge. Weigh your charge at the begining, set the powder measure, then reload your rounds. Simple, easy, and safe.

At some point you have to trust the press to do the job.
BigDog[RE] is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2011, 15:36   #39
Colorado4Wheel
Senior Member
 
Colorado4Wheel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: CO
Posts: 14,415
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigDog[RE] View Post
I am going to chime in here and say that the more you stop the reloading rhythm to weigh your charges, the better the chance of getting a squib round or a double charge. Weigh your charge at the begining, set the powder measure, then reload your rounds. Simple, easy, and safe.

At some point you have to trust the press to do the job.
I have been saying the same thing for a while.
__________________
Steve
Colorado4Wheel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2011, 15:47   #40
IndyGunFreak
KO Windows
 
IndyGunFreak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Indiana
Posts: 30,492
Send a message via ICQ to IndyGunFreak Send a message via AIM to IndyGunFreak Send a message via MSN to IndyGunFreak Send a message via Yahoo to IndyGunFreak Send a message via Skype™ to IndyGunFreak


Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxerglocker View Post
I agree with Jack's statements, well thought out reply with merit. However not realistic at all.
I hate saying +1.. but..

+1

IGF
__________________
Quote:
Ronald Reagan
"If we ever forget that we are One Nation Under God, then we will be a nation gone under."
"Man is not free unless Government is limited"

Last edited by IndyGunFreak; 02-12-2011 at 15:48..
IndyGunFreak is offline   Reply With Quote

 
  
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:52.




Homepage
FAQ
Forums
Calendar
Advertise
Gallery
GT Wiki
GT Blogs
Social Groups
Classifieds


Users Currently Online: 583
109 Members
474 Guests

Most users ever online: 2,672
Aug 11, 2014 at 2:31