GlockTalk.com
Home Forums Classifieds Blogs Today's Posts Search Social Groups



  
SIGN-UP
Notices

Glock Talk
Welcome To The Glock Talk Forums.

 
  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-14-2012, 06:54   #1
Bob Hafler
Senior Member
 
Bob Hafler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,205
It only a 22

It's only a little 22. How effective can it be? It can be effective enough to take a BG out of the fight.
Bob Hafler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2012, 16:57   #2
bac1023
Senior Member
 
bac1023's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: PA
Posts: 92,651
I wouldn't want to get hit by any 22, but there's no way the 22 short is an ideal SD round.
__________________
.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
bac1023 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2012, 02:50   #3
Bob Hafler
Senior Member
 
Bob Hafler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,205
Quote:
Originally Posted by bac1023 View Post
I wouldn't want to get hit by any 22, but there's no way the 22 short is an ideal SD round.
Agree and I don't think they were going in that direction when they said it will kill the crap out of you.
Bob Hafler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2012, 05:31   #4
Njanear
Nagant-ophile
 
Njanear's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 1,773
At 1:47, he starts talking about the accuracy of the Minx at 15 yards but then converts everything to feet and comes up at 30.

GA Fellows: are these the guys from Moss Pawn?
__________________
Ron W. - south of Atlanta
Certified Glock Armorer - Oct.2010
GlockTalk Clubs- #10 Georgia Glocker; #3745 Bull Dawgs; #600: 10 Ring, .40S&W, Sub Club, Long Slide, Niners, Wheelhouse, MilSurp, Rimfire, 1911, Black Rifle
Njanear is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2012, 05:35   #5
edcrosbys
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: VA
Posts: 1,118
I love my 22. But I don't think of it as an "ideal self defense gun" as per the video.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fiddletown
There are four ways in which shooting someone stops him:
1. psychological -- "I'm shot, it hurts, I don't want to get shot any more."
2. massive blood loss depriving the muscles and brain of oxygen and thus significantly impairing their ability to function
3. breaking major skeletal support structures
4. damaging the central nervous system.

So as a rule of thumb --
More holes are better than fewer holes.
Larger holes are better than smaller holes.
Holes in the right places are better than holes in the wrong places.
Holes that are deep enough are better than holes that aren't.
There are no magic bullets.

Why would anyone think that a .22 will be enough when sometimes a .357 Magnum isn't enough. LAPD Officer Stacy Lim was shot in the chest with a .357 Magnum and still ran down her attacker, returned fire, killed him, survived, and ultimately was able to return to duty.
edcrosbys is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2012, 05:51   #6
edcrosbys
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: VA
Posts: 1,118
Since I was skeptical about the US Army and pine board, I went looking for it. Here is what I found:

Ballistic Characteristics of Wounding Agents
http://history.amedd.army.mil/booksd...s/chapter2.htm

Quote:
For many years, ordnance engineers had been using the penetration of 1-inch pine boards separated by a small air space (1 inch) for judging the relative efficiency of bullets. Subsequent investigation revealed this test to be far from precise because of variations in pine boards, as well as many other factors beyond reasonable control.
edcrosbys is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2012, 15:04   #7
Veedubklown
Senior Member
 
Veedubklown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Northwest AZ
Posts: 2,083
Quote:
Originally Posted by bac1023 View Post
I wouldn't want to get hit by any 22, but there's no way the 22 short is an ideal SD round.
I don't think they ever actually said "ideal", just effective. I don't want to stand in front of a BB gun. I'd be interested to see what 45ACP does at 450 yards, though. I bet it'd still be better than throwing a rock.
__________________
I don't always rock out with my glock out, but when I do, it's all the way.
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.
Veedubklown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2012, 10:47   #8
Adjuster
Senior Member
 
Adjuster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Ft. Lauderdale FL
Posts: 10,680
"It will kill the crap outta you"

Might be my new favorite tag line.

I kinda like these guys.


/
Adjuster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2012, 11:04   #9
Cream Soda Kid
Senior Member
 
Cream Soda Kid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Colorado
Posts: 1,252
In 1979 a friend of mine was shot with a .22 caliber handgun. The shooter appeared to be a gang-banger.

My friend was hit in the right armpit, the bullet pierced the top part of his right lung, then went through the valves of his heart, then through his left lung and stopped at one of his ribs on the left side.

After the shooting, (the bad guy got away) my friend walked into the house under his own power. He didnít know at the time if he had been hit or not. We looked at his chest and no wound was visible. We didn't know where the entry wound was at the time.

As we were checking him out, his eyes started to close and he went unconscious. The ambulance arrived.

He underwent surgery of course, his heart stopped 3 times while he was in surgery. His heart was permanently damaged and the surgeon implanted a pacemaker. He needed the device until he died a few years ago from an unrelated event.
Cream Soda Kid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2012, 10:49   #10
Adjuster
Senior Member
 
Adjuster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Ft. Lauderdale FL
Posts: 10,680
When they are shooting the Mynx you can appear to hear the trigger press/click before the gun fires. Am I hearing this correctly? Or is this just some sort of camera/recording anomaly?


/
Adjuster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2012, 12:20   #11
glocked1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 104
I love when people talk about 22lr like they are toys.
glocked1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2012, 13:48   #12
Brian Lee
Drop those nuts
 
Brian Lee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Up a tree.
Posts: 7,939
The .22LR is a caliber that will usually kill your best friend by accident almost every time. For SD, it will piss off the bad guy and only strengthen his resolve to kill you almost every time.

If you are a legal hunter, .22LR would let a large wounded animal get away almost every time. If you are a poacher, it will easily kill deer, sheep, pigs and elk with a head shot almost every time.

Squirrels & paper targets are about the only use where the results are not unpredictable - but I still love the .22LR for what it is.
Brian Lee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2012, 14:04   #13
mac66
Plant the seed
 
mac66's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Save America
Posts: 7,907
"For SD, it will piss off the bad guy and only strengthen his resolve to kill you almost every time."

Sorry, you fail. Nobody wants to get shot, particularly more than once.

I investigated a bunch of shootings in my career. I don't care if the the bullet is a 22 or a 44, getting shot with anything will ruin your whole day.
__________________
Every American a Rifleman

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.

Last edited by mac66; 03-15-2012 at 14:11..
mac66 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2012, 14:21   #14
Cream Soda Kid
Senior Member
 
Cream Soda Kid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Colorado
Posts: 1,252
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Lee View Post
The .22LR is a caliber that will usually kill your best friend by accident almost every time. For SD, it will piss off the bad guy and only strengthen his resolve to kill you almost every time.

If you are a legal hunter, .22LR would let a large wounded animal get away almost every time. If you are a poacher, it will easily kill deer, sheep, pigs and elk with a head shot almost every time.

Squirrels & paper targets are about the only use where the results are not unpredictable - but I still love the .22LR for what it is.
Yes I agree. I love my little Remington 597 .22 LR.

I take it to the range from time to time. Itís fun to shoot, it helps me maintain my marksmanship skills with a rifle. No, itís not the same as shooting my Ruger Mini-30, but itís still aiming through non-optical sights.

Itís cheap to shoot and it doesnít beat me up when I shoot it.
Cream Soda Kid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2012, 13:02   #15
ratf51
Senior Member
 
ratf51's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: NW GA
Posts: 1,025
I asked this question in a posting at Rimfirecentral that was along this same topic:

I recall reading an article a few years ago about a study done in England in the early days of WWII. A fellow looked at the .22lr as a possible defense round that could be easily used by civilians should the Nazis invade. They utilized dummies dressed in German military uniforms and kit, and iirc, the study showed that at 400 yards the .22lr was getting a minimum of 1" (I assume it was some type of wood/board) penetration after passing through the uniform. Maybe not lethal in that context, but sufficient to wound and slow down an advance. I have recently searched for this article (I can't remember the source I read it from) or the study itself but have come up short. Has anyone else read about or heard of this?
ratf51 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2012, 13:16   #16
cowboywannabe
you savvy?
 
cowboywannabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: on a planet near you
Posts: 21,888
SCHP Trooper was killed within 1 minute of being shot with a single .22lr fired from a mini revolver from NAA. Trooper fired 5 rounds of .38spl (from a .357 revolver) into the gut of the bad guy whom lived.

caliber does not make up for poor shot placement.
__________________
with Sarah Jane, Leela, Romana, Nyssa, and Tegan.

Facts are no match against enthusiasm and ignorance...

Last edited by cowboywannabe; 03-18-2012 at 10:32..
cowboywannabe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2012, 03:01   #17
slims00ls1z28
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: TN
Posts: 234
Likewise they showed us a video in training where some bg shot a trooper in the armpit over the vest during a struggle and the trooper then shot the bg point blank in the face with a .357. Trooper died (not right off)the perp did not.

There's also a kid at the local JV who killed his grandfather with a BB gun (through the eye believe it or not) and a convict I know with a .45 ACP bullet still in his head walking around.

I'm still grabbing the guage or glock (or any other gun in the safe for that matter) over the .22's though unless I'm just plinking.
__________________
Kalashinikov #364, Ruger Club #364, Tactical Shotgun Club #364, Rimfire club #364, Still waiting on 10MM #364

Last edited by slims00ls1z28; 03-18-2012 at 03:02..
slims00ls1z28 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2012, 04:05   #18
Skykevver
Proud American
 
Skykevver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Thomaston, GA
Posts: 141
Blog Entries: 1
Njanear,

Yes, these are the guys from Moss Pawn.


Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine
__________________
G23/S&W Sigma 9mm/Walther P22 --- USPSA/NRA Member

"Yes, life has its problems, and yes, there are negative things to face, but please accept one of (my)... maxims for livingóno misfortune is so bad that whining about it wonít make it worse." ~ Jeffrey R. Holland ~ :dancing:
Skykevver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-29-2012, 04:29   #19
Frog1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 211
Like any caliber, it is very effective when used within it's design limits. It is not ideal for quick and intense encounters with human beings or large animals. It is better than a stick, knife, or rock or calling 911.

It takes some time for it's terminal damage to manifest itself. But let no one with any brains at all think it won't kill you. And it can buy time in a struggle if used properly to evade the situation.
Frog1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2012, 09:10   #20
Mongosafari
El diablo verde
 
Mongosafari's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: currently stationed in Maine
Posts: 508
I ran across this a while back:
http://www.ruger1022.com/docs/israeli_sniper.htm

In the right circumstance it could be used to take the "fight" out of someone...
__________________
ďPoliticians and diapers both need to be changed regularly and for the same reason.Ē

Last edited by Mongosafari; 04-21-2012 at 09:11..
Mongosafari is offline   Reply With Quote

 
  
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 22:40.




Homepage
FAQ
Forums
Calendar
Advertise
Gallery
GT Wiki
GT Blogs
Social Groups
Classifieds


Users Currently Online: 1,035
242 Members
793 Guests

Most users ever online: 2,672
Aug 11, 2014 at 2:31