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Old 01-25-2013, 13:07   #95
10mm fan
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: southwest
Posts: 164
Originally Posted by tnedator View Post
First, I never made the type of "comfortable" comparisons that you did, and I would fully agree that being comfortable hitting on a woman is not like being comfortable carrying a weapon properly and safely. If you want to make "comfort" scenarios, it would be other dangerous endeavors where the only near 100% guarantee of safety is proficiency.

So, some realistic "comfortable" comparisons might be flying a plane, where a person that is proficient in all areas, including emergency landings with no power or short IFR stint if caught above a cloud layer, would be the difference between being "comfortable" flying a single engine plane vs. being nervous, or only wanting to go up with an instructor or another more experience pilot.

Maybe jumping out of an airplane, where the proficiency in packing your shoot, making sure all of your equipment is both in working order and properly setup, and the proficiency in using the equipment.

Maybe climbing the sheer face of a rock wall hundreds or thousands of feet above a canyon floor, where the difference between being proficient and not could be the difference between life and death.

We don't have a lot of data on defensive gun uses, but what data and reporting we do have, simply don't support your adrenaline dump induced femoral artery severing/hole in butt theory.

Again, IF a person is improperly trained (both in terms of formal training and practice) and is used to drawing his firearm, and putting his finger on the trigger (or in the trigger guard area) as soon as it clears leather, then, yes, your adrenaline dump scenario would be accurate.

However, if a person has practiced thousands of times "properly" drawing/presenting his weapon, then that won't be an issue, because he won't be requiring fine motor skills to keep his finger hovering over, but not pulling, the trigger.
I see your point. But, I guess what I was trying to say is that even extensive and "perfect" practice should not give one full "comfort" when it comes to flight/fight situation. This comfort is a dangerous illusion, is what I'm trying to say. If you REGULARLY practice holstering/unholstering, drawing, aiming, shooting while injected with adrenaline, AND when your hands are shaking vigorously, AND when you heart rate and breathing rate are jacked up, AND when a genuine fear for your life is somehow induced - then I concede and you win this argument. But, unless you are special forces operator (which I believe 99.99% of folks here aren't), you aren't doing this sort of training regularly.

I don't understand what you mean by "We don't have a lot of data on defensive gun uses, but what data and reporting we do have, simply don't support your adrenaline dump induced femoral artery severing/hole in butt theory." To clear any misunderstanding, I'm not saying you are 100% sure to shoot yourself in the butt or sever your leg artery. What I'm saying, and what is EXTENSIVELY documented, is that adrenaline dump creates many very specific and very powerful physiological and psychological changes in one's body and mind, which reduce your ability to safely handle your weapon.

I think I will stop here, as we appear to start going in circles. I'll keep an eye on this thread for good arguments on this issue, though. In all honesty, I'm only about 90% committed to my position on this issue (because the issue is complex), and I appreciate your guys well thought-out arguments. I think we all benefit greatly from rationally and thoughtfully debating on this important topic. Cheers!
glock 4 gun; strider 4 knife

Last edited by vandros; 01-25-2013 at 13:20..
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