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-   -   On concealed carry, Illinois governor could lose policy battle but win poli (http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1494310)

HerrGlock 07-08-2013 01:54

On concealed carry, Illinois governor could lose policy battle but win poli
 
http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/g...d38a041da.html

clarson_75 07-08-2013 17:26

I knew the liberals would argue their way into a corner. You are from Ill. aren't you Herr? Do you think constitutional carry will take effect?

HerrGlock 07-08-2013 17:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by clarson_75 (Post 20440627)
I knew the liberals would argue their way into a corner. You are from Ill. aren't you Herr? Do you think constitutional carry will take effect?

Nope, I've driven through Chicago a few times is as close to living there as I've ever come.

My guess: They're going to override the veto tomorrow, it's going to be the one they passed and Quinn is going to bluster and whine until dooms day.

The state police will whine about having only 30 days to turn around licenses and the first ones will go out about 45-60 days after they're submitted.

A handful of people will be arrested for minor violations (in posted store) and some of the cops will try to make examples of these people.

There will be lawsuits galore with the state guys dragging their feet. The Chicago way of life will get turned all screwy because they have to issue permits and aren't allowed to have anything resembling the iron hand they've been used to.

Somewhere around January the first permits will hit the streets and Chicago politicians will be griping, moaning and complaining for years.

Next year one of the first things on the agenda state politician-wise will be adding restrictions on the permits followed by some amendments from down state relaxing the permit requirements and off limits places.

Caver 60 07-08-2013 17:52

I hope his 'campaign rally' stunt backfires on him.

Remember the SLPD is also rabidly antigun.

Fox 07-08-2013 18:53

I hope the legislators override his veto and make him look weak for the DNC primary elections. It will mean that he will spend alot of his money fighting off challengers in the primary election before the general election.

WarCry 07-08-2013 21:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by HerrGlock (Post 20440661)
Nope, I've driven through Chicago a few times is as close to living there as I've ever come.

My guess: They're going to override the veto tomorrow, it's going to be the one they passed and Quinn is going to bluster and whine until dooms day.

The state police will whine about having only 30 days to turn around licenses and the first ones will go out about 45-60 days after they're submitted.

A handful of people will be arrested for minor violations (in posted store) and some of the cops will try to make examples of these people.

There will be lawsuits galore with the state guys dragging their feet. The Chicago way of life will get turned all screwy because they have to issue permits and aren't allowed to have anything resembling the iron hand they've been used to.

Somewhere around January the first permits will hit the streets and Chicago politicians will be griping, moaning and complaining for years.

Next year one of the first things on the agenda state politician-wise will be adding restrictions on the permits followed by some amendments from down state relaxing the permit requirements and off limits places.

The only things you've got wrong here are the issue times. FOID cards are 30 days. the CCW is going to start with a 90-day issue time. Law enforcement has 30 days to lodge a protest if they want, which will then send it to a review panel (it is NOT "may issue". Local LEO cannot deny permits, they can simply file that think an applicant shouldn't be approved).

The ISP has 180 days to create an application, and 60 days to figure out who they're going to authorize as trainers. I don't know if they'll take the full 180 days to make the application, but it's probably 60/40 and pick 'em whether they do or not.

HerrGlock 07-09-2013 02:14

Now here's one for people to think about.

When can out of staters drive through Chicago with a CCW on their hip? As soon as it's signed? 60 days? 90 days?

I know the state police have 180 days to implement but when does the actual law take effect?

This is the one point that is amusing as hell whenever a new state passes this law, out of state people with permits recognized can carry sooner than instate people.

(edit) I see this in many of the articles
Quote:

If the override succeeds, the bill becomes law immediately.

http://www.bnd.com/2013/07/08/268693...#storylink=cpy
So out of state people driving from Indiana to Wisconsin could carry Wed morning if the veto is overridden.

I kinda feel sorry for the first handful of people who get pulled over and say, "I'm carrying a handgun on my hip..."

07 LMB Z06 07-09-2013 07:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by HerrGlock (Post 20441655)
Now here's one for people to think about.

When can out of staters drive through Chicago with a CCW on their hip? As soon as it's signed? 60 days? 90 days?

I know the state police have 180 days to implement but when does the actual law take effect?

This is the one point that is amusing as hell whenever a new state passes this law, out of state people with permits recognized can carry sooner than instate people.

(edit) I see this in many of the articles


So out of state people driving from Indiana to Wisconsin could carry Wed morning if the veto is overridden.

I kinda feel sorry for the first handful of people who get pulled over and say, "I'm carrying a handgun on my hip..."

I believe you can only carry from out of state as long as you are simply driving through IL to get to another destination (as you mentioned) and you do not exit your vehicle. You will want to verify this yourself before trying it, but I believe I remember that being the case.

If you plan on actually carrying in IL you will need a non-resident permit which will take just as long as a resident permit and will also cost you $300.

WarCry 07-09-2013 08:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by HerrGlock (Post 20441655)
Now here's one for people to think about.

When can out of staters drive through Chicago with a CCW on their hip? As soon as it's signed? 60 days? 90 days?

I know the state police have 180 days to implement but when does the actual law take effect?

This is the one point that is amusing as hell whenever a new state passes this law, out of state people with permits recognized can carry sooner than instate people.

(edit) I see this in many of the articles


So out of state people driving from Indiana to Wisconsin could carry Wed morning if the veto is overridden.

I kinda feel sorry for the first handful of people who get pulled over and say, "I'm carrying a handgun on my hip..."

The bill says "This Act takes effect upon becoming law".

House and Senate are both in session at 11am Central this morning (I can provide links to live feeds if anyone's interested), and if they both vote to override, then the law is effective upon the final (second) vote. If both vote by noon, you can drive from South Bend to Milwaukee for dinner tonight.

wjv 07-09-2013 09:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by HerrGlock (Post 20440661)
Somewhere around January the first permits will hit the streets and Chicago politicians will be griping, moaning and complaining for years.

The crime rate will go down and all of the politicians will take credit for it but none will name CCW as being part of the reason. . .

HerrGlock 07-09-2013 10:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by wjv (Post 20442380)
The crime rate will go down and all of the politicians will take credit for it but none will name CCW as being part of the reason. . .

Actually, I do believe Chicago is going to be the exception to what I've seen elsewhere.

There's going to be quite a few shootings at first. Remember, the gang bangers are used to being completely in charge of any part of the city they care to take.

It'll take a bit of reeducation before they figure out the people have teeth.

The other side of that is the people in and around Chicago are so conditioned to abhor guns that there won't be near as many carry permits there as there normally are elsewhere. It'll take (my guess) a year or so of getting used to "Hey, people actually carry firearms and are NOT criminals. Lemme see about this" frame of mind.

Jakestir 07-09-2013 10:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by HerrGlock (Post 20442402)
Actually, I do believe Chicago is going to be the exception to what I've seen elsewhere.

There's going to be quite a few shootings at first. Remember, the gang bangers are used to being completely in charge of any part of the city they care to take.

It'll take a bit of reeducation before they figure out the people have teeth.

The other side of that is the people in and around Chicago are so conditioned to abhor guns that there won't be near as many carry permits there as there normally are elsewhere. It'll take (my guess) a year or so of getting used to "Hey, people actually carry firearms and are NOT criminals. Lemme see about this" frame of mind.

This and I would assume a pistol permit from the city is still required. Also mag limits and such. A lot of hoops for the average person to jump through.

Sent from my Milestone X2 using Ohub Campfire mobile app

WarCry 07-09-2013 10:37

House overrides veto 77-31

Off to the Senate.

HerrGlock 07-09-2013 10:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jakestir (Post 20442415)
This and I would assume a pistol permit from the city is still required. Also mag limits and such. A lot of hoops for the average person to jump through.

They cannot have mag limits or any other limit for handguns beyond what's set for the state in the bill sent to Quinn.

The House just overrode Quinn's concealed-carry AV 77-31. No discussion.

WarCry 07-09-2013 10:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jakestir (Post 20442415)
This and I would assume a pistol permit from the city is still required. Also mag limits and such. A lot of hoops for the average person to jump through.

Sent from my Milestone X2 using Ohub Campfire mobile app

Local ordinances on long-guns in place or passed within 10 days after adoption of this bill are valid. Anything after 10 days would be invalid (i.e. Cook County's AWB).

ANY handgun ordinances are invalid as of the adoption of HB0183, including Chicago's asinine city fees, licensing, registration, etc. All authority for handgun law rests solely with the state, negating other current ordinances on the books and banning any future ordinances.

IndyGunFreak 07-09-2013 10:46

What time is the recall vote.

blackjack 07-09-2013 10:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by WarCry (Post 20442512)
ANY handgun ordinances are invalid as of the adoption of HB0183, including Chicago's asinine city fees, licensing, registration, etc. All authority for handgun law rests solely with the state, negating other current ordinances on the books and banning any future ordinances.

I'm glad to see this part and I hope they can pull it off. I expect this is what will be tied up in court with various groups in the vanguard: home rule cities, anti-gun advocates, etc.

WarCry 07-09-2013 11:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackjack (Post 20442525)
I'm glad to see this part and I hope they can pull it off. I expect this is what will be tied up in court with various groups in the vanguard: home rule cities, anti-gun advocates, etc.

No court-challenges needed. In order for any legislation to overrule the Home Rule, they require a 3/5th super majority. Both houses passed 183 with that margin and room to spare.

I mean, it COULD be challenged, of course, but it was all done straight up according to the law of IL. If they hadn't wanted to overrule the Home Rule authority, we would have had CCW 3 years ago.

Jakestir 07-09-2013 11:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by WarCry (Post 20442512)
Local ordinances on long-guns in place or passed within 10 days after adoption of this bill are valid. Anything after 10 days would be invalid (i.e. Cook County's AWB).

ANY handgun ordinances are invalid as of the adoption of HB0183, including Chicago's asinine city fees, licensing, registration, etc. All authority for handgun law rests solely with the state, negating other current ordinances on the books and banning any future ordinances.

Thanks for the correction

Sent from my Milestone X2 using Ohub Campfire mobile app

blackjack 07-09-2013 11:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by WarCry (Post 20442574)
No court-challenges needed. In order for any legislation to overrule the Home Rule, they require a 3/5th super majority. Both houses passed 183 with that margin and room to spare.

I mean, it COULD be challenged, of course, but it was all done straight up according to the law of IL. If they hadn't wanted to overrule the Home Rule authority, we would have had CCW 3 years ago.

And the good news keeps on coming...:cool: There may be hope for IL yet -- it's just tough for me to overcome my own cynicism that is reinforced with such matters as "The Chicago Way."

WarCry 07-09-2013 11:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackjack (Post 20442702)
And the good news keeps on coming...:cool: There may be hope for IL yet -- it's just tough for me to overcome my own cynicism that is reinforced with such matters as "The Chicago Way."

I'm not QUITE ready to say it's a done deal yet. The bill passed the house with 89 votes, but only had 77 vote to override the veto. If there's that big of 'change of heart' in the Senate, there could be a problem.

Caver 60 07-09-2013 12:02

What about some activist judge legislating from the bench and at least delaying things by allowing numerous antigun court challenges? Happened when CCW was passed in MO. Took months to get it all straightened out.

Jakestir 07-09-2013 12:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by WarCry (Post 20442727)
I'm not QUITE ready to say it's a done deal yet. The bill passed the house with 89 votes, but only had 77 vote to override the veto. If there's that big of 'change of heart' in the Senate, there could be a problem.

Let's hope not. It would be nice if this state could at least do this right.

Sent from my Milestone X2 using Ohub Campfire mobile app

WarCry 07-09-2013 12:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jakestir (Post 20442747)
Let's hope not. It would be nice if this state could at least do this right.

Sent from my Milestone X2 using Ohub Campfire mobile app

I think it'll be okay, but the loss of 12 votes was pretty drastic in the House.

RHVEtte 07-09-2013 13:20

Is the Senate back in session and voting on this yet? If they don't pass it by the end of the day, what happens?


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