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-   -   Light Primer Strikes (http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1467643)

mjkeat 01-26-2013 20:09

Light Primer Strikes
 
I have been experiencing light primer strikes w/ a converted Saiga.

I ran a box of Winchester 7.62x39 through it w/o issue. This is not the case w/ Wolf black box and their Military spec ammunition.

I'm thinking it's due to the hammer spring.

Any suggestions?

troy_v 01-26-2013 20:23

I have the same issue on a cheap-o M+M M10-762 with Tapco G2 trigger. I'd like to get some ideas on fixes.

HWI 01-26-2013 21:54

The Russian ammo has harder primers than US made ammo.
Replacing the hammer spring would be a fine place to start since they are really cheap and easy to replace.

How old is the Saiga? How does the firing pin look?

mjkeat 01-27-2013 00:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by HWI (Post 19915821)
The Russian ammo has harder primers than US made ammo.
Replacing the hammer spring would be a fine place to start since they are really cheap and easy to replace.

How old is the Saiga? How does the firing pin look?

Yes, exactly why I came to the conclusion that it was probably a weak spring issue.

Firing pin is GTG. Checked it against another that has been 100%.

I have no idea on age as I purchased it used. Like most firearms it looked almost untouched when I picked it up. It's a shame people never really shoot their firearms.

It's a great rifle when it functions. No AR but it's quite accurate and makes 100 yard hits on steel w/ ease using an H1 4moa. I want to run it through a class when it is able to run reliably.

Could I bend the springs to get me by until I can order new ones? If so how would I perform this? I'm not really up to speed on AKs.

mjkeat 01-27-2013 00:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by troy_v (Post 19915528)
I have the same issue on a cheap-o M+M M10-762 with Tapco G2 trigger. I'd like to get some ideas on fixes.

I'll purchase the M10 from you if you'd like to pawn it off on someone.

HWI 01-27-2013 00:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by mjkeat (Post 19916138)
Could I bend the springs to get me by until I can order new ones? If so how would I perform this? I'm not really up to speed on AKs.

Not sure how well bending it would work, but it's worth a shot. I would remove the spring and then bend forward the portion that pushes against the back of the hammer and then reinstall it.

I am going to throw out there that it is odd for a hammer spring to give out, they are extremely durable, but it is worth a try since it would be a simple fix if it is the problem.

K-Var sells Bulgarian ones for like $8 iirc.
Damage Industries sells US made ones for $7, but I cannot vouch for their quality.

mjkeat 01-27-2013 00:23

So what else could it be causing light primer strikes? There's not a whole lot going on inside of this thing.

HWI 01-27-2013 00:35

Maybe the firing pin is jacked, could be flattened out in the back or front, though you said that you already checked that and it's good. Or maybe if the face of the hammer is messed up.

I am no AK smith, so not really sure what else could cause it.

captainstormy 01-27-2013 01:58

Might try soaking the bolt in a cleaning solvant and getting a can of air to blow any gunk in it out. Dunno if that's the problem in your ak bit I've seen that I. SKSs before.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

mjkeat 01-27-2013 17:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by HWI (Post 19916174)
Maybe the firing pin is jacked, could be flattened out in the back or front, though you said that you already checked that and it's good. Or maybe if the face of the hammer is messed up.

Thank you.

I am no AK smith, so not really sure what else could cause it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by captainstormy (Post 19916250)
Might try soaking the bolt in a cleaning solvant and getting a can of air to blow any gunk in it out. Dunno if that's the problem in your ak bit I've seen that I. SKSs before.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

Tried. Did not work.

toshbar 01-27-2013 20:32

For future reference, the first two numbers of a saiga are the year manufactured.

Make sure the hammer is hitting the back of the bolt flush. Sometimes the hammer is mis-formed and hits the bolt at an angle, or off center. I don't think ammo would cause this though.

mjkeat 01-27-2013 21:31

Would knowing the date of manufacture make a difference ?

It is not the ammunition. It runs fine in the other AKs and VZ58.

If the hammer isn't striking true what can be done to remedy the problem?

HWI 01-27-2013 21:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by mjkeat (Post 19919868)
If the hammer isn't striking true what can be done to remedy the problem?

Replace the hammer. Generally a pretty cheap component, can normally be had for under $10.

twag4 01-28-2013 11:54

I saw the same thing happen to a guy that installed his hammer spring incorrectly in a norinco. He made it work...some of the time. He was convinced the rifle was junk. I told him a Chinese kalish was a great rifle. We corrected it then it ran flawlessly.

mjkeat 01-28-2013 14:19

Nice story. How?

toshbar 01-28-2013 18:57

Hammer spring should fit like this

http://www.gunco.net/tutorials/ak-47/fcg_removal/11.jpg

mjkeat 01-28-2013 21:07

So referencing that photo would I bend the springs up, down, or?

toshbar 01-29-2013 10:56

I wouldn't bend the hammer spring. I was posting the photo to make sure you have it positioned the right way. Some people will put the legs of the spring beside the trigger, instead of on top of it.

jbremount 02-02-2013 08:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by toshbar (Post 19925548)
I wouldn't bend the hammer spring. I was posting the photo to make sure you have it positioned the right way. Some people will put the legs of the spring beside the trigger, instead of on top of it.


I have done conversions on two Saiga and I have never heard of them not running 100% with Russian ammo. AK guns are robust and don't light strike. They fire ammo with hard or recessed primers well.

My bet is..

(1) that when you moved the fire control group forward,
(2)you some how have the hammer or hammer springs installed incorrectly.
(3)the trigger pin is not been held in place correctly by the shepards crook or plate, whatever you are using.(or not using)

mjkeat 02-02-2013 10:41

I can't see any difference.

http://i997.photobucket.com/albums/a...ps0c29a07e.jpg

toshbar 02-02-2013 15:18

Is your hammer hitting the rails on its swing? If I push my hammer side to side it will hit the rails, but when firing, it has never light striked and the hammer is always centered when I take the bolt carrier out.

jbremount 02-02-2013 16:41

From what I know, You first have to make sure you have the trigger axis pin and hammer axis pin secured with a Shepard's crook or better, an axis pin retaining plate. If you installed a hammer that has been "modified" for use with the Bolt Hold lever, it will be shorter on one side. The side closer to the lever. You will need to add a washer in it's place to make up for the space if the Bolt Hold lever is not used. That will center the hammer.

jbremount 02-02-2013 17:08

From your picture, your hammer looks like it may be hitting the rails or the "hammer axis pin" is not pushed in correctly. Maybe it the illusion of the picture. For the hammer to hit the rails during it swing should be almost impossible if parts are correct or in spec. What kind of aftermarket hammer or fire control internals are you using? You probably could run a test with the original Saiga's hammer and a small washer/spacer on the side the BHO lever is on. The hammer should never touch the rails in its swing to hit the firing pin.

The BHO lever on the Saiga is not original AK fire control internals. Some toss it out to make it as reliable as the original fire control internals, some keep it as an extra feature of a sporting rifle.

mjkeat 02-02-2013 17:50

No BHO on this one. I'll check the hammer but I don't recall it rubbing or anything interfering w/ it's movement.

jbremount 02-02-2013 18:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by mjkeat (Post 19942111)
No BHO on this one. I'll check the hammer but I don't recall it rubbing or anything interfering w/ it's movement.


What brand of hammer/trigger are you using?


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