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-   -   Protect Yourself Without Ever Firing a Shot? (http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1343126)

Captains1911 05-19-2011 12:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by NMGlocker (Post 17365639)
And if the bad guy doesn't run away?
Whatcha gonna do now Willis?

If the bad guy continues the life threatening act, then he goes down, you don't pull it if you aren't prepared to use it. But if the act of drawing it causes him to stop whatever threatening behavior he was exhibiting, then great.

Captains1911 05-19-2011 12:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by happyguy (Post 17368171)
I'm not going to be the guy who draws his gun and waves it around.

I might draw it quietly and keep it hidden if it looks like I might need it momentarily, but as a general rule I'm not going to draw it unless I intend to use it, though circumstances can change quickly and it might become unnecessary to shoot.

Regards,
Happyguy :)

My point exactly

NecoDude 05-19-2011 13:10

In my CCW class we were instructed that IF we decide to draw and cover, we loudly tell the BG to cease his behavior that caused you to draw (think "Demolition Man"). That way if you do put them down, witnesses can attest that you drew as last resort and gave them opportunity to withdraw. So in this scenario if you draw and de-escalate, there wouldn't be any charges filed against you. That's how it was explained to me, hope I never have to prove the theory.

NMGlocker 05-19-2011 15:56

You draw with the intent and justification to stop an immediate threat of death or grave bodily harm.
Period.

FireForged 05-21-2011 14:44

It is not my intention to ever pull a gun for the purpose of showing it (waving it around) or pointing it (for effect). If I pull a firearm it will be for the purpose of firing it. If while I am in the "process" of drawing it and firing, the badguy desides to stop what they doing- I will gladly rehoslter.

CoyoteDrifter 05-24-2011 21:08

Sometimes you don't need to draw to diffuse a situation. One time I was in a convience store with my wife. She went over to use the ATM in the store. While she was standing there a scumbag came in, circled around an isle and started walking toward her. I knew by the way he was walking (fast) and looking around that he wasn't shopping. I stepped in between them, placed my hand on my gun (IWB holster) under my shirt and looked him straight in the eye. By the look on his face he immediately knew what it meant. He abruptly turned around, scoffed something off a shelf, and zipped out the door. This wasn't a life threatening situation so I wasn't justified in pulling the gun, but I effectively changed the outcome without "brandishing".

steveksux 05-25-2011 01:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by NMGlocker (Post 17356000)
You pull your gun without the justification for using it.
The guy you pull it on isn't intimidated.
Now what are you going to do?

Give the other guy legal justification for using deadly force against you.

Randy

David Armstrong 05-25-2011 09:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by PEC-Memphis (Post 17368415)
Unless, perhaps, you happen to be a PPD officer?

Do you really want to go down that road again??

PEC-Memphis 05-25-2011 10:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Armstrong (Post 17398990)
Do you really want to go down that road again??

Na, the pavement has been beaten off of this road so much that it would take all of Barry's infrastructure stimulus money to even make it walkable.

uhlawpup 05-25-2011 10:26

1. Beware of "as a general rule" statements.
2. Beware of summaries of the law. Look at the law itself.
3. Beware of shackling yourself to a scenario based on what you think would happen.
4. Overthinking a situation can be as dangerous as underpreparation.
5. Increase your skill and personal awareness, and act in each situation according to its individual facts, and the rules.

SCmasterblaster 05-25-2011 10:53

I do not anticipate EVER bringing out my G17 and NOT shooting. The lethal threat to me will be displayed, and I shall draw and shoot the displayer immediately and repeatedly until he goes down hard.

Ruble Noon 05-25-2011 11:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by kensteele (Post 17355967)
Check with your state, they should have laws about how to handle this situation. In any event, I believe very few states allow you to "show" your weapon to "diffuse" the situation. That's what OC is for. :supergrin:

Kansas allows you to brandish your weapon to diffuse a situation if you feel that your life or anothers is under threat of death or bodily injury.

Old Junes 05-25-2011 12:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by CoyoteDrifter (Post 17397289)
Sometimes you don't need to draw to diffuse a situation. One time I was in a convience store with my wife. She went over to use the ATM in the store. While she was standing there a scumbag came in, circled around an isle and started walking toward her. I knew by the way he was walking (fast) and looking around that he wasn't shopping. I stepped in between them, placed my hand on my gun (IWB holster) under my shirt and looked him straight in the eye. By the look on his face he immediately knew what it meant. He abruptly turned around, scoffed something off a shelf, and zipped out the door. This wasn't a life threatening situation so I wasn't justified in pulling the gun, but I effectively changed the outcome without "brandishing".

This is exactly the kind of thing I was thinking about when I asked the question in my original post.

At the end of the day, having a CCW does not make you a cowboy and prudence is king. I get all of that. Thank you all for your thoughts. I am enjoying the discussion... feel free to keep it going!

talon 05-25-2011 12:37

Or.... the "scumbag" was an undercover LEO who needed to use the ATM and when he saw you "go for your gun" ducked behind cover and opened fire at you. Store video clearly shows you grabbing your gun under your shirt.


Quote:

Originally Posted by CoyoteDrifter (Post 17397289)
Sometimes you don't need to draw to diffuse a situation. One time I was in a convience store with my wife. She went over to use the ATM in the store. While she was standing there a scumbag came in, circled around an isle and started walking toward her. I knew by the way he was walking (fast) and looking around that he wasn't shopping. I stepped in between them, placed my hand on my gun (IWB holster) under my shirt and looked him straight in the eye. By the look on his face he immediately knew what it meant. He abruptly turned around, scoffed something off a shelf, and zipped out the door. This wasn't a life threatening situation so I wasn't justified in pulling the gun, but I effectively changed the outcome without "brandishing".


CoyoteDrifter 05-25-2011 20:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old Junes (Post 17399794)
This is exactly the kind of thing I was thinking about when I asked the question in my original post.

At the end of the day, having a CCW does not make you a cowboy and prudence is king. I get all of that. Thank you all for your thoughts. I am enjoying the discussion... feel free to keep it going!

Good discussion. Glad to join in. One other point that I didn't make quite clear is that the potential problem was avoided because I was aware of what was going on in time to give it a couple of seconds of thought, make a judgement, and react. That awareness helped give me time to send him the "message" before the situation got way too close for comfort. Your gun is a relatively a small part of what keeps you safe.


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